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  • Forced Marriages

    Posted by Rafia Khawaja on August 3, 2020 at 9:32 pm

    I would like to know whether there is anything in the Qur’an or Sunnah which allows under aged girls to get married. Some Parents are getting their underaged daughters married to older men for the sake of money. These girls have a miserable life, become mothers at an age where they should be playing with friends.Is there any sanction for this?

    Umer replied 4 years, 4 months ago 5 Members · 24 Replies
  • 24 Replies
  • Forced Marriages

    Umer updated 4 years, 4 months ago 5 Members · 24 Replies
  • Sameer Bhagwat

    Contributor August 3, 2020 at 11:12 pm

    Not sure about Qur’an and Sunnah but according to Islamqa the father has right to get her minor girl married off . Now, Islamqa is not the final authority on Islam but it is the majority scholar view.

    https://islamqa.info/en/answers/27305/marrying-a-thirteen-year-old-girl

    The validity of marriage to a minor girl is proven by the words of Allaah (interpretation of the meaning):

    “And those of your women as have passed the age of monthly courses, for them the ‘Iddah (prescribed period), if you have doubt (about their periods), is three months; and for those who have no courses [(i.e. they are still immature) their ‘Iddah (prescribed period) is three months likewise, except in case of death]”

    [al-Talaaq 65:4]

    So the ‘iddah for those who do not menstruate because they are too young is three months, and ‘iddah has to do with divorce after getting married, which indicates that the girls in question has been married and divorced.

    If she has not reached the age of puberty, then her father has the sole right to arrange her marriage and does not have to ask her permission.

  • A Hasan

    Contributor August 4, 2020 at 12:48 pm

    4:19 prohibits it

    • Sameer Bhagwat

      Contributor August 4, 2020 at 12:54 pm

      4:19 is about some specific women .. the tafsir from a scholar says :

      This means that the widow of the deceased should not be regarded as a part of his inheritance. After the death of the husband, his widow is quite free to live wherever she likes and to marry whomever she chooses after the expiry of her term.

      It is not talking about father’s right to arrange the marriage of his prepubescent daughter..

      If she has not reached the age of puberty, then her father has the sole right to arrange her marriage and does not have to ask her permission.

    • A Hasan

      Contributor August 4, 2020 at 1:00 pm

      The verse of surah talaaq is interpreted wrong- the word لم in Arabic does not accept that meaning.

      4:19 gives a principle that women have a right to live the way they want

    • Sameer Bhagwat

      Contributor August 4, 2020 at 1:04 pm

      Obviously 4:19 says that, but it is talking about a specific widow concept.. this thread is about marrying the under aged girls .. 4:19 has an entirely different context.

      Again, I am only quoting IslamQA .. it may be wrong or right I can’t say.. but they claim that ALL scholars of repute had this consensus.

      Ibn Qudaamah (may Allaah have mercy on him) said: With regard to a virgin who is still a minor, there is no difference of opinion concerning her (i.e., that her father may marry her off even if she objects). Ibn al-Mundhir said: Every scholar from whom we learned was agreed that it is permissible for a man to marry off his virgin daughter who is still a minor, if he marries her to someone who is compatible, and it is permissible for him to marry her off even if she objects and refuses.” Al-Mughni, 9/398

    • A Hasan

      Contributor August 4, 2020 at 1:07 pm

      So you are trying to say only widows have the right to choose how to marry?

      Their evidences should be examined

    • Sameer Bhagwat

      Contributor August 4, 2020 at 1:08 pm

      Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “A previously-married woman should not be married until she has been consulted, and a virgin should not be married until her permission has been sought.” They said: “O Messenger of Allaah, what is her permission?” He said: “If she remains silent.”

    • A Hasan

      Contributor August 4, 2020 at 1:09 pm

      This can mean many things eg custom of society. Also hadiths are not independent sources

    • Sameer Bhagwat

      Contributor August 4, 2020 at 1:10 pm

      Here Prophet said a ruling for marriage.. so if it is authentic hadith, it is a proper Islamic ruling.

    • Sameer Bhagwat

      Contributor August 4, 2020 at 1:09 pm

      I am not saying anything, I am just quoting that all scholars had consensus on this issue.

  • Faisal Haroon

    Moderator August 4, 2020 at 1:11 pm

    Islam has not specified any legal age of marriage, and it’s quite natural since the age of maturity is not a static number across time and cultures. If as a society it is determined that rights of some citizens (children in this case) are abused, the state should make laws to prevent it.

    That said, child marriages are still a commonplace in countries like the United States.

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Child_marriage_in_the_United_States

    • A Hasan

      Contributor August 4, 2020 at 1:12 pm

      @faisalharoon does the Quran specifically order consent of both parties?

    • A Hasan

      Contributor August 4, 2020 at 1:21 pm

      @faisalharoon or that maturity is required?

  • A Hasan

    Contributor August 4, 2020 at 1:30 pm
  • Sameer Bhagwat

    Contributor August 4, 2020 at 1:38 pm

    The tafsir of 65:4 from Maududi :

    Here, one should bear in mind the fact that according to the explanations given in the Qur’an the question of the waiting period arises in respect of the women with whom marriage may have been consummated, for there is no waiting-period in case divorce is pronounced before the consummation of marriage. (Al-Ahzab: 49). Therefore, making mention of the waiting-period for the girls who have not yet menstruated, clearly proves that it is not only permissible to give away the girl in marriage at this age but it is also permissible for the husband to consummate marriage with her. Now, obviously no Muslim has the right to forbid a thing which the Qur’an has held as permissible.

    • Umer

      Moderator August 4, 2020 at 2:03 pm

      “And those of your women who have ceased menstruating and they also who have not menstruated [in spite of reaching its age] [1], if you have any doubts about them, then their waiting period is three months. And the waiting period of pregnant women is till they deliver the child. God will ease the hardship of [those among you] who fear Him”. (65:4)

      ________________

      [1] The Quranic words are وَاللَّائِي لَمْ يَحِضْنَ. In the Arabic language, the word لَمْis used for total and strong negation. Hence the expression cannot connote those girls who have not started to menstruate; it can only connote girls who have not menstruated in spite of reaching the age.

    • Sameer Bhagwat

      Contributor August 4, 2020 at 2:13 pm

      I don’t know Arabic .. I only refer to English translations of Qur’an .. if they got it wrong, I don’t know. I am not the one who is claiming.. but even other tafsirs are claiming the same.

      Here is translation by Mohsin Khan :

      Mohsin Khan: And those of your women as have passed the age of monthly courses, for them the ‘Iddah (prescribed period), if you have doubts (about their periods), is three months, and for those who have no courses (i.e. they are still immature) their ‘Iddah (prescribed period) is three months likewise, except in case of death] . And for those who are pregnant (whether they are divorced or their husbands are dead), their ‘Iddah (prescribed period) is until they deliver (their burdens), and whosoever fears Allah and keeps his duty to Him, He will make his matter easy for him.

    • A Hasan

      Contributor August 4, 2020 at 2:19 pm

      Brother Umer what does total strong negation have to do with this? @UmerQureshi

    • Umer

      Moderator August 4, 2020 at 2:35 pm

      If I were to simplify my understanding, there are several words in Arabic used for negation and ‘lam’ is used when something exists but doesn’t happen, otherwise for negating initiation of something word ‘lamma’ should’ve been used.

  • Sameer Bhagwat

    Contributor August 4, 2020 at 2:17 pm

    Tafsir : Jalal – Al-Jalalayn

    And [as for] those of your women who (read allā’ī or allā’i in both instances) no longer expect to menstruate, if you have any doubts, about their waiting period, their prescribed [waiting] period shall be three months, and [also for] those who have not yet menstruated, because of their young age, their period shall [also] be three months — both cases apply to other than those whose spouses have died; for these [latter] their period is prescribed in the verse: they shall wait by themselves for four months and ten [days] [Q. 2:234]. And those who are pregnant, their term, the conclusion of their prescribed [waiting] period if divorced or if their spouses be dead, shall be when they deliver. And whoever fears God, He will make matters ease for him, in this world and in the Hereafter.

  • A Hasan

    Contributor August 4, 2020 at 2:25 pm

    Anyway- some people don’t menstruate until 16. So the verse could be taken to mean that they have achieved mental understanding but not physical maturity. Mental understanding is a requirement as per other places. Please refer to the link I sent

    • Sameer Bhagwat

      Contributor August 4, 2020 at 2:28 pm

      These tafsirs clearly mention the “young age” as the reason for not menstruating yet. If these tafsirs are wrong, I have no further argument.. but if these tafsirs of early reputed scholars are right, then the reason you cite is wrong. Is physical maturity not a requirement ?

  • Sameer Bhagwat

    Contributor August 4, 2020 at 2:36 pm

    This tafasir also says “too young” .

    Abbas – Tanwîr al-Miqbâs min Tafsîr Ibn ‘Abbâs

    (And for such of your women as despair of menstruation) because of old age, (if ye doubt) about their waiting period, (their period (of waiting) shall be three months) upon which another man asked: “O Messenger of Allah! What about the waiting period of those who do not have menstruation because they are too young?” (along with those who have it not) because of young age, their waiting period is three months. Another man asked: “what is the waiting period for those women who are pregnant?” (And for those with child) i.e. those who are pregnant, (their period) their waiting period (shall be till they bring forth their burden) their child. (And whosoever keepeth his duty to Allah) and whoever fears Allah regarding what he commands him, (He maketh his course easy for him) He makes his matter easy; and it is also said this means: He will help him to worship Him well.

  • Umer

    Moderator August 4, 2020 at 2:40 pm

    Stop posting each and every tafseer. This behavior is equivalent to spamming. You’ve already made your point and I have clarified it from the point of view of our discourse.

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