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  • Does God Have A Body?

    Ahsan updated 2 weeks, 4 days ago 2 Members · 15 Replies
  • Ahsan

    Moderator March 6, 2025 at 6:19 pm

    Response from Chatgpt (after obtaining subtitles from notegpt)


    1. Selective Interpretation of Anthropomorphic Language

    The argument assumes that descriptions of God’s hands, face, and movement must be taken literally rather than metaphorically or analogically. However, Islamic theological traditions have long recognized that such descriptions are metaphorical, pointing to God’s attributes rather than physical form.

    The Quran itself states in Surah Ash-Shura 42:11, لَيْسَ كَمِثْلِهِ شَيْءٌ (There is nothing like unto Him), which directly negates the idea of a physical, human-like body.

    2. Ignoring the Classical Islamic Interpretation (Tafsir & Aqeedah)

    Classical Islamic scholars, including those from the Ash‘ari, Maturidi, and Mu‘tazili traditions, interpreted anthropomorphic verses in a manner that does not ascribe a physical body to God.

    The Quran states in Surah Al-An’am 6:103, لَا تُدْرِكُهُ ٱلْأَبْصَـٰرُ (Vision does not perceive Him), which suggests that God is beyond human perception and form.

    If God were embodied, then He would be limited to space and time, contradicting Surah Al-Hadid 57:3, which describes God as الْأَوَّلُ وَالْآخِرُ وَالظَّاهِرُ وَالْبَاطِنُ (the First and the Last, the Manifest and the Hidden), implying transcendence beyond physical constraints.

    3. Misinterpretation of Quranic Cosmology

    The argument claims that the Quran presents a unified cosmos where all beings, including God, exist within space. However, the Quran repeatedly emphasizes God’s absolute sovereignty over the universe:

    Surah Al-Ikhlas 112:4: وَلَمْ يَكُن لَّهُۥ كُفُوًا أَحَدٌ (And there is none comparable to Him).

    Surah Taha 20:5: ٱلرَّحْمَـٰنُ عَلَى ٱلْعَرْشِ ٱسْتَوَىٰ (The Most Merciful rose over the Throne). Many scholars interpret istawa as a metaphor for divine authority rather than physical enthronement.

    4. Lack of Quranic Support for an Embodied God

    The argument relies on absence rather than presence—it claims that since the Quran does not explicitly deny God’s physical form, it must assume one. However, the Quran also does not affirm such an idea, making it a weak argument from silence.

    Instead, the Quran consistently uses negations regarding God’s likeness to creation, which suggests a theological framework against embodiment rather than supporting it.

    5. Overlooking the Quranic Concept of Transcendence

    The Quran describes God as beyond human comprehension (Surah Al-Baqara 2:255) and beyond limitations of time and space. Any attempt to ascribe a body would impose human-like attributes, contradicting Quranic descriptions of His uniqueness.

    Conclusion

    The argument that the Quran supports an embodied notion of God is weak because it selectively interprets verses, ignores well-established theological discourse, and neglects direct Quranic statements that emphasize God’s transcendence. A more comprehensive reading of the Quran suggests that anthropomorphic descriptions serve metaphorical or symbolic purposes rather than implying a literal, physical form.

    • elliot gilly

      Member March 7, 2025 at 4:11 am

      I think all the tafsir traditions come 150 years later and have been effected by greek Neoplatonism but the Qur’an in it’s original historical context in the ancient near east holds to the view that god is transcendent but also has a luminous form and this is what the people would of believed. “There is nothing like him” does not nessercerily mean in an absolute sense but relative as he can create and we cannot. Sinai uses an example of an Egyptian god that says ‘there is nothing like him” and yet he still resembles creation.

    • Ahsan

      Moderator March 8, 2025 at 2:34 am

      Your argument assume that we drive our understanding from Tafsirs effected by greek philosphers. That is not true.

      We understand Quran from Quran first.

      The Quran repeatedly affirms God’s absolute uniqueness beyond human understanding:

    • 1) Surah Ash-Shura 42:11: لَيْسَ كَمِثْلِهِ شَيْءٌ (There is nothing like unto Him).

    • 2) Surah Al-An’am 6:103: لَا تُدْرِكُهُ ٱلْأَبْصَـٰرُ (Vision does not perceive Him).

    • 3) Surah Al-Ikhlas 112:4: وَلَمْ يَكُن لَّهُۥ كُفُوًا أَحَدٌ (And there is none comparable to Him).4) Surah Al-A‘raf 7:143 recounts Hazrat Mosa asking to see God, and God replies, لَن تَرَىٰنِى (You will never see Me) which shows there is something visible

    • The argument of relative uniqueness is not correct due to arabic linguistics. Phrase لَيْسَ كَمِثْلِهِ شَيْءٌ uses a double emphatic negation (لَيْسَ + كَـ + مِثْلِ), which implies absolute uniqueness.

  • elliot gilly

    Member March 8, 2025 at 3:23 am

    If that is the case why did some early Muslims like ibn taymiyya argue that God does have a body and used the same Qur’an to prove there point?

  • Ahsan

    Moderator March 8, 2025 at 3:33 am

    First of all Ibne Tamiyah(born 13th century) was against all influence of Greek philosophy and was not an early scholar. Secondly, he or anyother muslims scholar never affirmed to human like god or have any body or anythink like creation.

    they took the meaning literally as to avoid speculation which can lead to misguidance.

  • elliot gilly

    Member March 8, 2025 at 3:38 am

    Which verse in English uses a double negation To show god’s uniqness?

  • Ahsan

    Moderator March 8, 2025 at 3:39 am

    42:11

  • elliot gilly

    Member March 8, 2025 at 10:51 am

    Where is the double negation in the verse? It only seems like one? Sorry

  • Ahsan

    Moderator March 8, 2025 at 10:17 pm

    no need to be sorry.

    لَيْسَ مِثْلُهُ شَيْءٌ
    itself means nothing resembles, addition of ka ( كَـ ) makes it absolute by adding second layer of negation

  • Ahsan

    Moderator March 8, 2025 at 10:18 pm

    @Irfan76 sb please confirm

  • elliot gilly

    Member March 9, 2025 at 8:08 am

    In Arabic, “ka” is not a negation particle; the most common word used to negate a sentence is “la” (لا), which translates to “not” in English. This is what it says online?

  • Ahsan

    Moderator March 9, 2025 at 11:38 am

    please wait, i have asked @Irfan76 sb,a scholar on this forum, to confirm or negate my statement.

  • elliot gilly

    Member March 9, 2025 at 5:47 pm

    I think this link may prove your point? https://gschishty.blogspot.com/2013/07/allah-exist-without-place.html

  • Ahsan

    Moderator March 10, 2025 at 12:27 am

    thank you for sharing the link for detailed understanding

  • Ahsan

    Moderator March 6, 2025 at 6:19 pm

    For Ghamisi sb view see

    Discussion 18914

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