-
The Test Of This World
This question is a follow-up in relation to the ask Ghamidi Q&A of 20/12/20 that took place after Mizan class here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zVDKDW-FaWo
Ghamidi sahab mentioned how if we just go to a jungle and live there then our book of deeds will just be empty. My follow-up is that if we went to a jungle and lived there for our lives, and prayed non-stop, fasted every day, did tasbeeh, pondered on the word of God etc wouldn’t our book of deeds be overflowing with light?
Sure we wouldn’t have charity or helping the elderly, but we also wouldn’t have taking others rights and making others sad.
Why should we approach the dunya except for the things that are needed to be able to do some charity etc? It is not necessary for me to waste 14 years to become a doctor, I can simply spend that time praying.
-
24 Replies
-
The Test Of This World
updated 3 years, 12 months ago
5 Members
·
24
Replies
-
This life is all about manifestation. Infact, this life began for the very reason of God manifesting Himself to all of the creation. We are not only passive recipients.
We have to get to know Him through our actions (through our manifestations). We get to know Him through His names. And we get to know His names through our actions. By knowing what Hes not we learn better what He is. All of this could only be achieved I think by more and more action. The scenario that you mentioned would not help in achieving the main purpose of this life.
-
Aren’t all of these forms of worship preparing me for proper action? If we turn it the other way around, then that goes against what God Himself tells us of not needing our worship.
-
This is a very interesting point. The point of the worship I guess is to, like you said, make us remember to be good in our lives.
-
Yes – Is to remind us about God and this is how He is. (By making us be like Him). We know how He is, by what He wants from and for us. What He wants from and for us is what we can know through His laws for us. Those laws are to be applied, obviously. Then their application alone can leave us affirming whether Hes Just etc – the way He describes Himself. And whether that’s the only true way or good way to be. So yes I think worship would then constantly be reminding us about the ‘source’ that provides us with those very laws to improve our action. (Only so we can perform better).
-
So what would become of a person who lived in the jungle alone?
-
Goes back to his intention i guess. Whether he understood this point as we discussed it above, and then chose otherwise consciously. Or whether he genuinely believed that isolated lifestyle to be better in the sight of God.
-
-
I also think that it depends upon the messengers (saw) and their respective followers. So where the followers of isa (as) could have a room for such misinterpretation, I don’t think it makes sense for those present at the time of Muhammad (saw) and the generations to follow.
Then another thing to consider would be – did that person adopt such a lifestyle solely for his own peace? Or for some selfish gains. Or did he truly make all the effort he could to preach and change. Then when nothing worked, he ended up like that frustrated. I think it depends upon a whole lot of things. The most important one being, I think, the messenger of the time.
-
This world is temporary. The ultimate form of submission to my master is to worship him day in and day out- glorifying him, fasting to show him that I will starve myself for him etc etc. So why should I waste my time on becoming let’s say an engineer when this world is temporary and all I’m doing is reducing the amount of time I am submitting to God. Let’s say I become an engineer, the 6+ years spent in university could’ve been used for prayer and fasting and tasbeeh. Instead of learning Newton’s laws of motion I would be praying. Why should I chase after this dunya with a tenth of my lifespan for something that has absolutely no bearing on my eternal life?
-
There are two realms that we’re operating in. The spiritual or the metaphysical and the physical, which is this dunya. This is the very place of manifestation. And it is only through manifestation (of our actions, laws etc) – we learn what is beyond this physical world. So it is equally important to know about this world and make sure that its working fine (as much as it is in our control). So everything that comes under knowing or contributing to making the worldly life easier i guess is worship too. Since it was given to us by Him. (If one is approaching it with that intention of course). Scholars in the past have used Geometry to come up with profound realisations regarding the Being and Essence of God. So.
(In my very personal opinion it doesn’t make sense to me, to then, logically explain the purpose of becoming an artist perhaps?)
-
How is it equally important to know about the world? Is it so important as to spend 6+ years chasing after it?
I don’t understand your last artist comment but I would raise the question that the artist is not helping anyone- instead of spending hours painting something- go pray some nawafil.
-
But then you’re not ‘chasing’ the dunya, are you? You’re studying to know and to earn as much so you can survive, out of the career you made. I think it depends on your approach. What is your intention when you’re going into it.
Regarding the next comment, i also believe the same as you.
-
If it comes down to survival then being a monk is enough surely?
-
Imagine me as a monk- no ask Ghamidi 😱 😂
-
Living life in a way that you’re not consumed by it. “Kaafir ki ye pehchaan ke gumm hai afaaq main, momin ki yeh pehchaan ke gumm hai uss main afaaq.”
I wanted to bring out this shade of the word ‘survival’ 😃
-
Exactly. Though I don’t know what aafaq means I can get the gist 😂
-
-
Islam gives great importance to education. If we look at the first five verses revealed from the Holy Qur’an, we can see that they have words “اقـــــرأ” (read) , “قـــــلــــم” (pen), “عــــلَّـم” (teach). If we spend our time in gaining education it can be ibadat depending on our niyah.
Prophet Muhammad صَلَّى ٱللّٰهُ عَلَيْهِ وَسَلَّمَ is a role model for us. He is the best in dunya and akhira. He was best businessman, best teacher, best fighter, etc. (worldly matters too). There is no رہبانیت in Islam.
Nation can succeed because of its people. The downfall of Islamic civilization came when the individuals restrained themselves from gaining worldly knowledge. Muslims should learn different fields of sciences and other fields as a religious obligation and a human responsibility.
-
These were not the first revealed verses.
Who said the prophet صلى الله عليه وسلم was the best teacher fighter and businessman? Iirc he asked other sahabah for military tactics and in the case of cross pollination he clearly said ‘you know better about this world than me’.
But the downfall was in this world. And this world is temporary. So does it even matter?
-
Ok I should say commonly known first revelation or in Quran. Sorah Fatiha is the first according to Ustadh Sahab research. JAK for reminding.
Shura with Sahaba shows his excellency as a commander. And he was not a farmer so by accepting his mistake, shows his best ikhlaq.
Please let us know before you go to the jungle. You deserve a party.
-
No problem!
Yes I agree but he isn’t the best in worldly matters.
Don’t worry I’ll let everyone know if I decide to go 😉
-
-
I haven’t read all the responses, but based on your question, I would say that going to jungle and praying to Allah is good, but not what Allah has put us in this World for. Allah doesn’t need anyone’s prayer and he did not need to create a new creation to have more creatures praying to him. There were plenty of Angels already doing that and they are perfect without making mistakes like humans.
Allah created human to test. If someone sits in a jungle and only performs prayer, then his test is easy and so is his rewards per prayer are lower. On the other hand if someone is living among people and has to strive very hard to stay on the right path and for that person it is not possible to pray all the time and actually it is hard for that person to even pray 5 times….then one prayer of that person or one good deed of that person would be lot more valuable than 100s of prayers and good deed by the one living in jungle. Same goes for bad deeds. The one living amongst human will be punished much less for the same bad deed than the one in jungle. The point is that reward and punishment is in proportion to how much you strive or control tempetation and that is the proof of your strength of your belief in Allah. The one sitting and praying in jungle is proving less of his strength of belief in Allah as he is not fighting difficulties and tempetations. So as a conclusion the one in jungle is not better off by just sitting and praying all day and avoiding making mistakes. Also, since Allah doesn’t need our prayer, I believe prayer is to remind us to maintain our belief in Allah strong and to remind ourselves to do good deeds and follow Allah’s instructions. That is the test we are sent here to pass.
-
ما شاء الله a very balanced response that makes a lot of sense! جزاكم الله خيرا
-
-
God has created this universe to test human beings. In order for this test to take place, He has decided to send human beings to this world through the process of procreation. The institution of family has been established in order for life to sustain on earth. Families form societies, and we have to live in these societies in order for our test to take place. It is very important to understand the scheme of God so that we have the right perspective in approaching His message.
The entire content of religion can be categorized into ‘al-hikmah’ (the wisdom) and ‘al-kitab’ (the law). Al-Hikmah can be further categorized into ‘imaniyat’ and ‘ikhlaqiyat’. Imaniyat are the matters of creed, however ikhlaqiyat contains wisdom about matters related to our relationship with God as well as other people. Al-kitab on the other hand contains worship rituals, but a large majority of it consists of laws relating to other people. For example, laws about nikah, tallaq, state and political matters, economic matters, inviting others towards Islam, rules of jihad, etc. are all part of al-kitab.
Once we understand God’s scheme and His message in the framework of His scheme, it’s very clear that it’s not His intent for people to go through their tests in seclusion. We must remain in the examination room in order for the examination to take place.
-
Great!
-
-
Ahmad Shoaib: For sharing and discussing with others, I am also posting my thoughts here from another discussion about the sense of justice or injustice. It seems to be relavent here too.
I think when Allah created us, he gave us option to be like his other creations without free will or be better than other creatures and have a free will. We chose free will. To get the status of Allah’s best creation, Allah asked us to go through a test. The test was that if we use free will for the purpose of good, he will reward us with Junnah and if we misuse it, he will punish us in hell. We accepted this test to be better than other creatures and to earn heaven. I think Allah then put some basic knowledge of righ, wrong, justice and injustice in our boot sector of our brain (computer analogy) and erased all other memories and sent us to this World.
Sponsor Ask Ghamidi
