-
Who’s The Author Of The Quran?
A plain reading of Quran makes it clear to an open mind that it can’t be a work of a human. However, it can very well be a job of an angel or some other (extraterritorial) creature superior to human but not necessarily God. How can we establish with an irrefutable reason that the book is from none other than God Himself?
-
41 Replies
-
Who’s The Author Of The Quran?
updated 3 years, 10 months ago
5 Members
·
41
Replies
-
Whoever is the author of the Quran is whom we refer to as God. In the Quran itself He claims that He is the Almighty God, and we find no reason for Him to lie to us.
-
The only perfect being is the God Himself. If the Quran was written by anyone else, we surely would find mistakes or contradictions in the text.
Quran 4:82
Translation by Asad
Will they not, then, try to understand this Qur’an? Had it issued from any but God, they would surely have found in it many an inner contradiction!
-
We worship the Creator of the universe who is not created or begotten. We believe the book is from the same Creator.
However, some non muslims do believe in the supreme power who’s created the universe and some of them also believe that the Creator is a conscious being who has designed the universe for a specific purpose rather than it being a result of a random selection.
So far so good. However, how do we assure them that the Creator has an interest in the people on this tiny planet abd he is not indifferent?
-
Personally, for me that would only be a question when I know that creatures as complex as humans also exist elsewhere in the universe. In the absence of that, it’s pretty clear that this tiny blue planet is at the dead center of attention for the Creator.
-
‘What if the Quran is an experiment by extraterritorial creatures?’
You could present the evidence of the excellence and majesty of the kalaam in the Quran, its prophecies, and the circumstances of its revelation.
‘How would an alien send an angels or reveal something into my mind?’.
The simple answer would be that God does it, we don’t know how- so an alien can do it too. This alien would be, no doubt, highly intelligent and technologically adept.
The same can be said for the circumstances of revelation.
Now the question arises why did the aliens send this?
The simple answer is we don’t know. Could be an experiment- because we can’t judged based on our limited human knowledge what the intentions of said aliens are. We can simply guess. The aliens could just be an oppressive civilisation- that’s also a possibility given the state of this world.
My question boils down to basically: What is it about the Quran that makes it UNDOUBTEDLY divine? Not just divine, but undoubtedly from the ultimate creator of this universe?
Basically my point is that we can’t use the magnitude of the excellency if the Quran to disprove that it’s from aliens since we need to make sure that the appropriate paradigm shift from human to alien knowledge is accounted for
-
The only answer I can think of is: if we were being deceived- then the creator of the universe who is undoubtedly qaim bil qist would have to interfere as a necessary requirement of his justice.
But then one could argue that the reason you believe him to be qaim bil qist is because humans love justice and they are created by the creator so he could not be unjust.
The refutation to that point is you are assuming human logic is actually correct. What if the aql we use to make references itself is naqis?
-
This question still stands I think
-
Until a new source of knowledge can be discovered, all questions of this kind only stand irrelevant.
-
I had a feeling that would be the answer. But as ghamidi sahab discusses in his al hikmah lectures, if we even entertain the slightest possibility that God could be unjust, out whole emaan would come crashing down. So this is a slight possibility then surely?
-
You’re confusing the sane voice of your conscience with feeling 😂
What Ghamidi sahab said was in a context. He explained why there’s no chance of God being unjust. Perhaps you need to watch those videos again.
-
I remember the videos and the reasoning- that because we love justice so much, our creator could not be unjust. But this is assuming that the logical capabilities this creator gave us are actually in correlation with true logic. What if this inference we are making is simply not how reality actually occurs. It’s a bit hard to imagine but I think my point has been put across.
The crux of the issue is that if out logic was incorrect we would never actually know. So as humans we just go with the flow of what we have been given. For example the universe could’ve been created 5 mins ago and all my memories are fake. But we would basically never know.
How do we deal with these types of questions? Do we just say ‘as a human, my knowledge will never allow me to know the full, final truth the way that God can know it’?
Then what about the tiny possibility about our logic being naqis? How do we love God the same way with this horrific possibility lurking in the back of our minds?
-
It’s not only because we love justice. He explained the entire concept of thesis / anti-thesis of this world and the hereafter etc. Once you understand that in detail then I think that there’s simply no question about justice of God – again within the bounds of our knowledge.
The question is not how do we deal with the kinds of questions that can’t be answered through our sources of knowledge. The question is whether or not we have enough information to make sound decisions and keep moving forward at this time. My answer is a resounding yes.
Once I understand my own handicap in something, I don’t think it’s very wise of me to keep spending my energy and effort being stubborn about it. I would much rather work on something to aid with my handicap, or I would accept it as is and call it a day.
-
I see.
-
As an example, if I know that my car only runs on the road, then in order for me to get to Mars I can’t simply sit in the car pressing buttons on my GPS. Either I need to get out of the car and build a spaceship, or accept that I cannot get to Mars.
-
My GPS provides driving directions to Mars!
-
I bet it does. Mars, Pennsylvania that is 😂
-
I have a strong feeling – the aliens hosted in Area 51 might have created this universe but I am still researching to get to the bottom of this. Stay tuned!
-
Yes please keep us posted!
-
-
1. For a man, it’s hard to write a book free of internal contradictions but not impossible.
2. It’s hard for a man to come up with a book of such wisdom and knowledge as the Quran. However, if we humans find aliens on some other planet, who are not as knowledgeable as we are, someone from us can send them a book full of wisdom and knowledge to dupe them to believe it’s from the supreme power of the universe and ask them to believe and do things that can mitigate risk of them becoming a threat to the Earth anytime in the future. How would the aliens figure out if the book is indeed from God or not?
Until we find a logical answer to this question, we cannot tackle the concerns of modern day atheist philosophers (e. g. the likes of Richard Dawkins , Sam Harris etc) on Islam.
There might be a video from Sir Ghamidi on this.
-
If Quran is an enabler and help it’s believers to be more progressive and successful it would mean that the book is from God who is helping us to excel in this world to lead better lives and do not see humans as a risk.
On the other hand if the book makes people ineffective and less progressive, one might take it as if the author of book has a problem if people progress and become more capable and powerful on Earth.
If my above point makes sense, the next question will be if Quran makes us more effective or less effective on Earth?
-
I’ve had extensive talks with Sajid Hameed sahab on this exact topic.
First we have to get a few things straight:
How many creators are there? There is only one, otherwise there would be turmoil in the universe.
Why would these aliens be sending this message?
Is it for a joke?
The Quran rejects this idea that it is just a practical prank (by reading it).
Is it some experiment?
What sort of experiment is this that makes prophecies about the fall of the Romans etc etc? It makes no sense, there’s no controls nor clear variables.
We have evidence that the creator of the universe has interfered in it before. This can be seen in the human soul and the morality, language and aesthetic sense it holds. Therefore, this creator sending books again should be not very far-fetched.
-
Discussion 39921 • Reply 39972
This is a reply to myself
-
-
The assumptions are as follows:
1. there is a single superpower who is consciously designing, creating and running the universe.
2. The creator is indifferent or not interested in the affairs of people’s life on Earth – as we are not interested to know whats going on to the bugs in a pond somewhere.
3. However, there is another creature on another planet that is on a higher stage of evolution than man. They are trying to manage their own existential risks including a possibility of an attack from planet Earth. To mitigate the risk, they send a “divine” book that makes people think and behave in a way that slows down their learning abilities and progress to such a level they cannot gain enough power fast enough to attack or defeat them.
The above conspiracy theory can be debunked only if one can prove the Quran actually help us make more effective and progressive rather than other way round.
My own understand of Quran suggests that the book actually helps us accelerate our progress on Earth thru infaaq and problems solving that requires excellence and innovation. And therefore, we can infer that the book is from none other than God himself. The reason for posting the question here is to seek other perspectives and challenges as i am not sure to what extent the theory is logical.
-
There’s difference in known knowns, known unknowns, unknown knowns and unknown unknowns.
“Takhaayul” has no boundaries! Works for fiction but doesnt really help w/ fact based objective analyses
-
1. This is not an assumption. The universe running and the growing of new life and plants and new human souls being breathed into babies is an evidence of this universe being meticulously run. There can only be one runner of the universe otherwise the universe would be in turmoil and would not remain.
2. The very fact of human consciousness is evidence of divine meddling in human affairs. As the consciousness is undoubtedly supernatural, and since the creator is one, the same creator who created humans interfered with Earth.
3. The Quran resulted in much human progression during the Islamic golden age, leading to many discoveries that would help with the direction of the qibla etc. Also the rallying of the Muslims in surah Rum to destroy the Byzantines. Also if these aliens are so advanced that they can produce the Quran, how could we possibly harm them? If they can give direct revelation to humans and have governance over Rome which they caused to fall then why are they scared of us?
-
True point 1 and 2 in text above are facts and not assumptions. By assumption i actually meant “given” to ensure discussions stay on the question i am raising and do not get derailed.
Your reasoning makes a lot of sense to me but my question is not something that bothers me i am already convinced in my mind that the book is from none other than God and reason for this belief is not based on the outstanding features of the book but the author’s takeaway out of the book. If we understand what is in there for the author we can recognize him sufficiently well if it is God or someone else.
-
However, one of the three categories of atheists need a good reason to understand why the book cannot be from anyone other than God. So we need to provide something from the book that can be validated independent of the book e g logically or scientifically. If the evidence requires you to believe in the book first then take a verse as an answer this wont help non believers.
-
Then they should get the sequence right
-
The sequence is quite rational:
1. Someone or something has created the universe. This is easy to infer for many atheists.
2. Random selection vs intelligent design discussion can convince many that it is someone and not something who is designer, creator and operator of the universe. So far it’s easy.
3. Is the Creators interested in humans on Earth if so why? or maybe He is indifferent. We are discussing the 3rd question in the logical sequence.
-
If you have done point 1 and 2 then that means the atheist accepts that the human consciousness and mind is supernatural. That itself is evidence of the creator interfering with humans
-
Step 1 and 2 only prove that God is a conscious entity as the designer, creator and operator of the universe. But it does not explain why He is doing it and if at all what role He wants human to play to achieve His goals. If we can crack that question if we can then have a look at the book and see if it is aligned with that goal. This would be an irrefutable evidence that the book is from none other than the Creator.
God has many attributes and most if not all mean nothing if He is not a Creator and therefore it is the on going creation that makes the Creator God our Lord.
2ndly, by observation we can figure out that all elements of the universe are playing a role in the creation process. We can classify those roles into the following categories —
1. Energy eg laws of nature, gravity, radiation etc
2. Fillers like different forms of materials
3. Reactors such as chemicals
4. Reproducers or living things
5. Makers like honey bee makes hives or birds make nests and some animals even make tools for hunting
6. Designer — it’s only God who designs and assigns a role to His creations to deliver the design. The only other creature we know who can design things is human
7. Creating out of nothing — only God is capable of doing it.
-
Discussion 39921 • Reply 40105
Now we know our role as designer on Earth we need to explore if Quran is helping us excel in this role or stopping us.
I guess this should determine who has authored the book, right?
-
I think Faisal sahab highlighted that we need to know the limits of our knowledge. We cannot know the intentions of the creator. We just have to take his word on it I guess.
-
How do we know we have reached the limits. Maybe the answer is there somewhere in Quran or elsewhere
-
So you’re saying that while the atheist doesn’t know any Calculus, first we need to prove that a Calculus book can actually teach him Calculus before he will read the book to find out for his own self. I would like to ask that atheist in what other walk of life does he use this kind of simpleton logic?
-
No that is not my point.
My point is if Quran says if this book were from someone other than God you would find many contradictions.
We need to show non believers that all human authored books have internal contradictions but Quran has none. This is not so easy to prove. So we need something else like that.
-
👍
I’m pretty certain AI can be our friend!
-
Also you would have to prove that this human book with no contradictions has all the other things the Quran has. Also that the book claims to be from God I guess
-
-
The only problem with your theory is that it’s based on a hypothesis. If one wants to cross that boundary, then they don’t even have to think very hard – an enormous amount of hard work has already been carried out in the world of philosophy, and it still hasn’t stopped. In fact, some of the ideas presented by great philosophers are extremely commendable.
The choice for us comes down to whether we want to believe in hypothetical ideas, or something that has proven to be credible on the basis of evidence. The biggest mistake we make in this regard is not being able to precisely determine the bounds of our own sources of knowledge.
-
Surat No 55 : سورة الرحمن – Ayat No 33
یٰمَعۡشَرَ الۡجِنِّ وَ الۡاِنۡسِ اِنِ اسۡتَطَعۡتُمۡ اَنۡ تَنۡفُذُوۡا مِنۡ اَقۡطَارِ السَّمٰوٰتِ وَ الۡاَرۡضِ فَانۡفُذُوۡا ؕ لَا تَنۡفُذُوۡنَ اِلَّا بِسُلۡطٰنٍ ﴿ۚ۳۳﴾
اے جنوں اور انسانوں کے گروہ! اگر تم یہ کرسکو کہ نکل بھاگو آسمان اور زمین کے اطراف سے تو نکل بھاگو! پر تم پروانۂ راہدی کے بدون نکل نہیں سکو گے!
-
This verse looks some what relevant. Please can you elaborate a bit more what point are you trying to make here.
Sponsor Ask Ghamidi
