Ask Ghamidi

A Community Driven Discussion Portal
To Ask, Answer, Share And Learn

Forums Forums General Discussions Quranic Arabic

  • Quranic Arabic

    Posted by Ahmad Shoaib on July 29, 2020 at 1:40 pm

    How can we come to know the meaning of a Quranic word without knowing how it was undertood historically. If we can’t come to know without historical books then the meaning and interpretation of the Quran should be based on hadith literature no?

    Ahmad Shoaib replied 3 years, 8 months ago 2 Members · 18 Replies
  • 18 Replies
  • Quranic Arabic

    Ahmad Shoaib updated 3 years, 8 months ago 2 Members · 18 Replies
  • $ohail T@hir

    Moderator July 29, 2020 at 1:47 pm
    • Ahmad Shoaib

      Contributor July 29, 2020 at 2:01 pm

      So the Quranic Arabic was preserved perfectly by various scholars and groups- did I understand correctly? So there is no actual need to refer to historical records as this nuance of the Arabic language was kept preserved?

      Could you give me some references of this?

      @Sohail

    • $ohail T@hir

      Moderator July 29, 2020 at 2:24 pm

      Tagging @Hassan sb. and @Gazdar sb. for some books/literature related to Jahiliya period. Thank you

    • Ahmad Shoaib

      Contributor July 29, 2020 at 2:25 pm

      But bhai there should be no need for any historical evidence to explain the Quran if the language is preserved. And if the Quran can explain itself

    • $ohail T@hir

      Moderator July 29, 2020 at 2:28 pm

      Right, language is preserved in books (daur-e-jahiliyaa ka adab). I was asking learned folks to give you some names.

    • Ahmad Shoaib

      Contributor July 29, 2020 at 2:39 pm

      How much do we rely on these works? For example an Arab when he reads Quran says Maury is ukhta harun may thing the Quran got lineage wrong. So how much to we rely on this. And why should we rely on books of jahiliya that are not as authentic as Hadith surely?

    • Ahmad Shoaib

      Contributor July 29, 2020 at 2:49 pm

      This makes it seem like the Quran is based on khabr wahid and non established history to make its meanings’ known

    • Ahmad Shoaib

      Contributor July 29, 2020 at 2:56 pm
    • Ahmad Shoaib

      Contributor July 29, 2020 at 3:17 pm

      Because this statement is then true:

      The meaning of some of the vocabulary used wouldn’t have been known if it werent for historical reports of what they meant at that time

    • Ahmad Shoaib

      Contributor July 29, 2020 at 8:09 pm

      I find it hard to digest the last sentence. How could the meaning of our holy book only be unlocked after having to consult books that are from a historical record. Unless we claim that these books hold a similar ijma and tawatur to the Quran. But Ghamidi sahab above said that the discerning of these books is similar to that of discerning sahih to daif hadith. So at the end of the day to us erstand the Quran we do need khabr wahid after all?

    • Ahmad Shoaib

      Contributor July 30, 2020 at 11:30 am
    • $ohail T@hir

      Moderator July 30, 2020 at 12:01 pm

      @AhmadShoaib you are mixing up two completely different issues. The reason to consult daur-e-jahiliya adab is to understand and appreciate the “language” and “literary devices” used in Quran which was revealed in the “language” of Quraysh.

      Pls. watch Hassan’s video again

      https://solitaryspark.com/2014/11/10-common-literary-devices-with-examples.html

    • Ahmad Shoaib

      Contributor July 30, 2020 at 12:05 pm

      @Sohail But brother Sohail- the literary devices are present in the Quran already- I have no qualm with that. But the actual words of the Quran- eg one place Allah says ليعلم الله- this means in modern Arabic so Allah can know- this is illogical as Allah already knows all. So when we consult previous classical dictionaries we find out this word is also used to say so Allah can make evident/so Allah can test. And also when Mary is called اخت هارون- a modern Arab thinks this means sister- and this would lead to wrong understanding of the meaning of the word in context .

      This means we need to consult historical works to actually understand some Quranic words

    • $ohail T@hir

      Moderator July 30, 2020 at 12:08 pm

      Right, this is exactly what Hassan is saying that in order to understand the language of Quran we need to look at the contemporary (to Quran) sources and that is daur-e-jahiliya ka adaab! The examples you provided in your comment validates this.

    • Ahmad Shoaib

      Contributor July 30, 2020 at 12:11 pm

      And I have a problem with this because it means that the interpretation of the Quran is based on some language that Is. It even preserved today @Sohail

    • $ohail T@hir

      Moderator July 30, 2020 at 12:16 pm

      All languages evolve, Arabic is no exception. Hassan explained this with examples (Urdu) in his video, he also mentioned how classical Arabic is preserved!

      See this book

      https://www.amazon.com/History-Development-Language-Muhammad-al-Sharkawi/dp/1138821527/ref=mp_s_a_1_3?dchild=1&keywords=Arabic+language+evolution&qid=1596129168&sr=8-3

    • $ohail T@hir

      Moderator July 30, 2020 at 4:03 pm

      1 hour and 4 minutes in this video

    • Ahmad Shoaib

      Contributor July 30, 2020 at 4:19 pm

      Ok brother @Sohail . So the problem is still there- someone has to learn this language. And I’m not sure how Hassan sb explained it but a language is woven into the fabric of a society. A modern Arab finds it difficult sometimes to understand the Quran. I just had an idea- is a Quranic Arabic preserved just like Latin?

You must be logged in to reply.
Login | Register