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  • Who Are Ahle Baith? And Is Hazrat Ali One Of Them?

    Posted by Yusha ibn ghaffar yusha on August 26, 2020 at 12:21 pm

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YEL7HBc7eYo

    in this video ghamidi sahab refer to this surah’s verse if am right. can u explain in detail.

    And abide in your houses and do not display yourselves as [was] the display of the former times of ignorance. And establish prayer and give zakah and obey Allah and His Messenger. Allah intends only to remove from you the impurity [of sin], O people of the [Prophet’s] household, and to purify you with [extensive] purification.

    Waqarna fee buyootikunna walatabarrajna tabarruja aljahiliyyati al-oola waaqimnaassalata waateena azzakatawaatiAAna Allaha warasoolahu innama yureeduAllahu liyuthhiba AAankumu arrijsa ahlaalbayti wayutahhirakum tatheera

    explain the view point regarding ahle baith. thank you.

    Qamar Hashim replied 3 years, 7 months ago 5 Members · 13 Replies
  • 13 Replies
  • Who Are Ahle Baith? And Is Hazrat Ali One Of Them?

    Qamar Hashim updated 3 years, 7 months ago 5 Members · 13 Replies
  • Yusha ibn ghaffar yusha

    Member August 26, 2020 at 12:33 pm

    While this verse is among the verses which introduce some especial law for Muhammad’s wives with feminine plural pronouns, the pronoun referring to Ahl al-Bayt is in the masculine plural. The great majority of the hadiths quoted by al-Tabari in his Tafsir describes Ahl al-Bayt as the five people of the cloack. Another interpretation says that according to the declaration at the beginning of the previous verse, that is “O wives of the prophet, you’re not like any other women”Quran 33:32, this verse include Muhammad’s wives.

  • Danish Ju

    Member August 26, 2020 at 1:57 pm

    Salamun alaikum,

    It is an interesting rather very important topic which has ever been dealt in very detail even than there have been a lot of controversies among the Shia and Sunni Muslims. I normally avoid participating in controversial discussions and I do really not intend to intensify the disputes but to make people think over some neglected angles of the issues I would like to submit the following points as per my understanding. But before going through these submissions, I humbly request all of you to kindly read it with open-heartedness and for the moment, keep aside your pre-conceived beliefs. That may help you understand the matter. I appreciate any type of queries and criticism but in a civilized manner.

    The topic under discussion has manifold issues to analyze.

    First of all, it has to be checked what the word “Ahl-al-bait” means. Is it used for the family of Rasoolallah Sawaw or something else is meant here for.

    Secondly, who are the addressees (mukhatabeen) of the ayat No. 30 & 31 of Sura Ahzab.

    Thirdly, what is the “rijs” from which “Ahl-al-baits” have been made sanctimonious and pure.

    I think the key to this issue lies in the world Ahl-al-bait. I am sure all of you must be surprised to know that here the words Ahl-al-bait are not used for the family of RasoolAllah Sawaw. This term is comprised of two words and these are Ahl And Al-bait. The word Ahl is used to show the belongingness with someone or with something (like ahl-alkitab, ahl-alqura, ahl-almadina, ahl-at-taqwa etc are used in Quraan)whereas Al-bait is here used for the House of God that is Kaaba. Which is evident from ayat Nos. 2:125, 2:127, 2:158, 3:97, 5:2, 5:97, 8:35, 22:26 and 106:3 in which Al-Bait is used specifically for Kaaba..

    And this opinion is further strengthened from the Ayya “Innama yureedallaha le yuzhiba ankum-ur-Rijsa Ahl-al-bait” in which Ankum encompasses Rasoolallah Sawaw too. So basically here the specific addressees of the ayat were all the five members of Al-bait who gathered under the cloak. And it needs not to explain what specific relation they all have with Kaaba. Only one thing shall be enough to ascertain their belongingness from Kaaba that Allah SWT has taken covenant (Ahd) from Hazrat Ibrahim and Hazrat Ismaeel alehuma salam to keep the Kaaba pure in the following words:

    وَإِذْ جَعَلْنَا الْبَيْتَ مَثَابَةً لِّلنَّاسِ وَأَمْناً وَاتَّخِذُواْ مِن مَّقَامِ إِبْرَاهِيمَ مُصَلًّى وَعَهِدْنَا إِلَى إِبْرَاهِيمَ وَإِسْمَاعِيلَ أَن طَهِّرَا بَيْتِيَ لِلطَّائِفِينَ وَالْعَاكِفِينَ وَالرُّكَّعِ السُّجُودِ {125}

    Shakir 2:125 And when We made the House a pilgrimage for men and a (place of) security, and: Appoint for yourselves a place of prayer on the standing-place of Ibrahim. And We enjoined Ibrahim and Ismail saying: Purify My House for those who visit (it) and those who abide (in it) for devotion and those who bow down (and) those who prostrate themselves.

    And this covenant continues in Ale-Ibrahim till the Rasooallah Sawaw and Hazrat Ali K.a.w. whole the chain of Descendents of Hazrat Ibrahim remained the Key-Keeper or Custodian of Kaaba till Hazrat Ali born in the middle of Kaaba.

    Further, another point which is greatly ignored ever since is that the reference of the Wives of Rasoolallah Sawaw is mentioned in the Ayat no 28 & 29 of the very same sura which in the words of Shakir is as under

    33:28- O Prophet! Say to your wives: If you desire this world’s life and its adornment, then come, I will give you a provision and allow you to depart a goodly departing

    33:29- And if you desire Allah and His Messenger and the latter abode, then surely Allah has prepared for the doers of good among you a mighty reward.

    In the above reference, the Arabic words “Ya Ayohan-Nabi Qul le Azwajeka” are used which sufficiently prove that no other women relatives are included in this address. And if you deeply go through the above ayats you will conveniently find that the zikr of wives of Rasoolallah has been completed here.

    But after these ayats, in the ayat under discussion the Arabic words “Ya nisa-an-Nabi” are used which, where can be used for the wives of Rasooallah Sawaw, these also can be used for other women relatives (like daughters, sisters, granddaughters, mother etc). So to ascertain who the actual addressees of this ayat were, you will have to refer to the context. And if you find in another ayat the same Nisa-un-Nabi in a different phrase Nisa-ana where exclusion of all other relative women (including wives) is eventually proved, then you can safely ascertain that the ayat # 33:30 does not include wives rather it is specifically addressed to the then present Daughter (i.e. Fatima Al-Zehra A.S) and future daughters and granddaughters (i.e.,Saidanian). And the gist of this ayat is that the Saidanian (Daughters of An-Nabi Sawaw) are not like other women but they have twice the accountability and bindings (being the offspring of An-Nabi Sawaw) so they should take more care to keep themselves pure and should not behave like others.

    I hope I have made my point appropriately clear and if someone will open-heartedly analyze these submissions he can understand it easily.

    Iltemase Dua.

  • Umer

    Moderator August 27, 2020 at 7:09 pm

    I respectfully have to disagree with the explanation mentioned above by Danish Sahab. I would like to mention following points.

    Firstly, as a principle, language is not to be interpreted in terms of logic (mantaq) but it has to be interpreted in terms of how language is spoken (nutq-o-bayan). That means, in order to understand any sentence, we first look at the word itself, then we have to look at the sentence structure and then we see the context of the whole topic by looking at the flow of discussion. In case, there still remains any doubt (very rarely), then in order to establish meaning of any dubious word, we refer to other places of the kalam which have used the samilar word.

    Secondly, when we apply the same principle to the under consideration verses of Surah Ahzab, the words, the sentence structure and the context itself is speaking out loud that who are the addressees of these verses i.e. primarily, the wives of the Prophet (sws). For better portraying my point, you can refer to the translation in the footnote [1].

    Even if we remove the content included in the brackets and look at the flow of discussion, (33:28-29) has pinpointed the addressees of the ongoing directive to begin with i.e wives of the Prophet. Although, there is no confusion after looking at the whole sentence structure and content of the directive, the forth-mentioned verses also relate to Wives of the Prophet (sws), but since words “Women of the Prophet (Sws)” have been used here (33:30-31) instead of wives of the Prophet (sws), therefore it was claimed above that the direction of directive has been changed. However, it is our normal style of linguistics in which we use ‘biwiyon’ (wives) and ‘bibiyan’ (women) in place of one another and the sentence structure and context of the discussion clarifies easily whether bibiyan is used in place of biwiyan in the same meaning or not; which context clearly tells is the case in this scenario as well. Therefore, after hujjat of kalam itself, there is no need to add any other meaning to this verse in the absence of any indication (kareena) otherwise.

    Thirdly, the context is expressing it out load that here ‘Ahl-e-bait’ is a reference to People of Prophet’s household i.e. wives of the prophet (sws). There is no indication to take it in the meaning of “Bait-ullah”.

    Furthermore, the claim that there is use of masculine pronoun and therefore the wives of the Prophet (sws) are not meant here–is a gross misunderstanding of the linguistic style once again. Just for the sake of understanding, even in our urdu, we say it normally ‘yai maira khandaan hai’ or ‘mairay khandaan main itnay afraad hain’ etc. The sentence obviously includes the female members of the family as well. But if I address only women of my family and after addressing them use the word ‘O mairay khandaan waalo’, the context is telling it clearly that here my reference to ‘khandaan walo’ only includes women of my family. Same is the context and sentence structure of this verse.

    Fourthly, the above points get further solidified when you reach at verse (33:59). In this verse, when Allah wanted to include women other than wives of the Prophet (sws) in the directive, the words “Daughters of the Prophet (sws)” have been used explicitly to indicate this fact that now daughters have also been addressed in this directive along with other muslim women [2]. Another point which is worth-mentioning is this fact that Daughters have been addressed in plural, no single daughter has been pin-pointed by Allah in this verse, and there is no hint (kareena) present in the sentence to indicate it being a reference to one particular daughter.

    Lastly, since Quran has explicitly mentioned who actual ‘Ahl-e-Bait’ are; therefore, there is no question left to be asked in deciding this point. However, as far as other members of Prophet’s family like Hazrat Ali (rta) , Hazrat Fatima (rta) are concerned, they can be considered as ‘Ahl-e-Bait’ too, but only as a secondary category because Quran has clarified the primary category of ‘Ahl-e-Bait’, therefore, other people can only be included subservient to the primary ‘Ahl-e-Bait’–as a second tier category if you will.

    ___________________________________________________

    [1] [After being frustrated on this frontier, these hypocrites now want to create mischief in your houses. Hence,] O Prophet! Tell your wives: “If you seek the life of this world and its finery, come I shall release you honourably by giving you some provisions. And if you seek God and His messenger and the abode of the Hereafter, then, while disregarding all these things, seek it fervently because God has prepared a great reward for those who show a conciliatory attitude in a gracious manner. (33:28-29)

    Wives of the Prophet! For anyone of you guilty of open vulgarity, there is a twofold punishment and this is an easy proposition for God. And those of you who will remain obedient to God and His messenger and do righteous deeds, We will give them their two fold reward and We have prepared an honourable sustenance for them. (33:30-31)

    Wives of the Prophet! You are not like common women.If you fear God, do not speak softly [with these people] so that he who has an ailment in his heart should not have any false hope and speak to them in the conventional way. (33:32)

    Abide still in your homes and do not display your finery as women used to do in the days of jahiliyyah. And attend to your prayers, keep paying zakah and be diligent in the obedience of God and His Messenger. Women of this House! God wants to cleanse you from [the] filth [these hypocrites want to besmear you with] and to fully purify you. And communicate what is taught to you of the revelations of God and the wisdom revealed by Him. Indeed, God is Very Discerning and All-Knowing. (33:33-34)

    [2] [In order to protect yourself from their pranks,] O Prophet! enjoin your wives, your daughters, and the wives of all Muslims to draw over them a shawl [when they go out to places where danger lurks]. It is possible from this that they be recognized; then not be harassed. In spite of this, [if they make a mistake,] God is Forgiving and Ever-Merciful. (33:59)

    • $ohail T@hir

      Moderator August 27, 2020 at 8:37 pm

      Pls. comment on this also

      “Thirdly, what is the “rijs” from which “Ahl-al-baits” have been made sanctimonious and pure.”

    • Umer

      Moderator August 28, 2020 at 7:45 pm

      The context in this regard is very cleat that what kind of besmearing campaign hypocrites were onto–to put a blemish on Prophet’s(sws) household (i.e. wives of the Prophet) and to eventually damage the whole case of prophethood on moral grounds. That is why, keeping the context in mind, the very thing has been included in translation of Ghamidi Sahab that what this ‘rijis’ and its purification means in the very context of the verses:

      “God wants to cleanse you from [the] filth [these hypocrites want to besmear you with] and to fully purify you“.

  • Danish Ju

    Member August 28, 2020 at 4:42 pm

    Dear Umer Qureshi, Salamun Alaikum

    I too disagree with respect and please let me make this point clear that the principles for spoken and written languages are always different in all languages. And the same is more formal and precise when you frame a legal document. Specially in the Arabic language, you cannot compare simple Urdu and English phrases with Arabic phrases and more specifically with Quranic Arabic. That’s why it’s too difficult to communicate the exact meanings of most of the Quranic verses. So it is not so simple to say specially for Quranic linguistic that ‘jese ham kehtey hain’. In the Quran, every word is perfectly chosen and placed, so you have to peruse every sentence and word and try to ascertain the intended meanings of it.

    In the verses under discussion, there is a clear distinction between two different addressees. In the first two verses (28-29) the addressees are only the wives of Prophet SAWAW but afterward, in verses 30-34 the circle of addressees became broader and other women members of the family may also included in the khitab. So the explanation given by you in para three giving examples of words ‘biwiyan’ and ‘bibian may only be accepted if no other female members of Prophet SAWAW existed, but in presence of other female relatives, restricting the word Nissa to only wives cannot be correct.

    But on the other hand, after going through the verse no 61 of Ale-Imran which says

    مَنْ حَاجَّكَ فِيهِ مِن بَعْدِ مَا جَاءَكَ مِنَ الْعِلْمِ فَقُلْ تَعَالَوْا نَدْعُ أَبْنَاءَنَا وَأَبْنَاءَكُمْ وَنِسَاءَنَا وَنِسَاءَكُمْ وَأَنفُسَنَا وَأَنفُسَكُمْ ثُمَّ نَبْتَهِلْ فَنَجْعَل لَّعْنَتَ اللَّـهِ عَلَى الْكَاذِبِينَ

    “Those who dispute with you on this matter after true knowledge has come to you; then tell ‘Come! We summon our sons and your sons, and our women and your women, and ourselves and yourselves, and then we will pray and invoke the curse of Allah on those who lie.” We can easily ascertain that In this verse the phrase ‘Nisa-ana’ is used which could include all the female members of Nabi SAWAW but there was only Hazrat Fatima A.S was accompanied and none of the wives of the Prophit SAWAW was allowed to join.

    In addition to the above, verse no 33 has an extra-ordinary phrasing style and two different groups are addressed in one same ayat there. In the first part, the addressees are the same as in continuation from verse 30 but the second part of this ayat is a parenthetical phrase (jumla-e motariza) so it says:

    وَقَرْنَ فِي بُيُوتِكُنَّ وَلَا تَبَرَّجْنَ تَبَرُّجَ الْجَاهِلِيَّةِ الْأُولَىٰ ۖ وَأَقِمْنَ الصَّلَاةَ وَآتِينَ الزَّكَاةَ وَأَطِعْنَ اللَّـهَ وَرَسُولَهُ ۚ إِنَّمَا يُرِيدُ اللَّـهُ لِيُذْهِبَ عَنكُمُ الرِّجْسَ أَهْلَ الْبَيْتِ وَيُطَهِّرَكُمْ تَطْهِيرًا

    Which translates as “And (Ya Nisa Un-Nabi) stay quietly in your houses, and make not a dazzling display, like that of the former times of ignorance; and establish regular prayers, and give regular charity, and obey Allah and His Messenger; Surely, Ya Ahl-al-Bait, Allah only wishes to keep you away from all the uncleanliness, and to keep you ultimately purified.”

    And after this parenthetical phrase again instructions to the female member of Prophet SAWAW continue as:

    وَاذْكُرْنَ مَا يُتْلَىٰ فِي بُيُوتِكُنَّ مِنْ آيَاتِ اللَّـهِ وَالْحِكْمَةِ ۚ إِنَّ اللَّـهَ كَانَ لَطِيفًا خَبِيرًا

    Remember the Signs of Allah and the words of wisdom which are rehearsed in your homes. Verily Allah is Subtle, All-Aware.

    So in the second part of ayat 33 the address has been made to the Ahl Al-Bait and as I mentioned earlier that this phrase is comprised of two parts; one is Ahl and the other is Al-Bait. If the mukhatebeen would be family of Prophet SAWAW then the words should have been used like Ahle-bait-un-Nabi or Ahle-bait-ur-Rasool, and instead of word “Alaikum” there should be “Alekunna”(which is used for feminine plural presents, and the examples of the same you can find in same verses under discussion), then with these phrases there would be no doubt that the family members of Prophet SAWAW are addressed. But in the absence of these phrases and presence of word and phrase ‘Alaikum’ (which is used for Masculine plural presents, that means that atleast among the three addressees, one must be male) and “Ahl-Al-Bait” there remains no doubt that Ahl Al-Bait are other than Ahle Bait-un-Nabi or Ahle Bait-ur-Rasool. Basically you are not trying to understand Arabic linguistics and you confuse it with normal Urdu or English linguistic.

    Further, verse No. 33 has the same special Quranic linguistic as is used in Sura-e-Yousuf verse 29 as

    يُوسُفُ أَعْرِضْ عَنْ هَـٰذَا ۚ وَاسْتَغْفِرِي لِذَنبِكِ ۖ إِنَّكِ كُنتِ مِنَ الْخَاطِئِينَ

    In verse 59 of Al-Ahzab, the same instructions for all the Muslim women are intended to communicate so by using phrases “Azwajeka wa Banateka wa Nisa-il-momineen” it is communicated, but in verses 28-29 the instruction given to Wives was no relevance with other female members of the family of Prophet so the distinction is made by using different phrases.

    Iltemase Dua

    • Umer

      Moderator August 28, 2020 at 7:54 pm

      Assalamualikum! I have read your point of view and nothing in that nullifies my argument regarding context of the verses which would force us to go look for the meaning of some words from other places. Since this is a place of Quran where the context has been made so explicit that any argument which ignores the context of verses is not logical to me. That being said, I respect your point of view but it doesn’t reconcile with the context of the verses according to me.

  • Qamar Hashim

    Member August 28, 2020 at 6:06 pm

    Salam un Aleykum,
    This is a rather interesting discussion, and looking at the answers i would like to add the interpretation of the Quranic verses in question in the light of Hadith as well. I appreciate all the answers however the interpretation given in hadiths also agree with the interpretation laid out by Danish sahab. To be brief i will just put forth 2 traditions from sahih muslim and then leave for the people to ponder over them.

    The first tradition is in relation to the event of mubahila which is mentioned by Danish sahab above in reference to the verse no 61 of surah Aal e Imran where ‘Nisa-ana’ is used only for Hazrat Fatima A.S:

    SAHIH MUSLIM HADITH NO. 6220
    Amir b. Sa’d b. Abi Waqqas reported on the authority of his father that Muawiya b. Abi Sufyin appointed Sa’d as the Governor and said: What prevents you from abusing Abu Turab (Hadrat ‘Ali), whereupon be said: It is because of three things which I remember Allah’s Messenger (may peace be upon him) having said about him that I would not abuse him and even if I find one of those three things for me, it would be more dear to me than the red camelg. I heard Allah’s Messenger (may peace be upon him) say about ‘Ali as he left behind hrin in one of his campaigns (that was Tabuk). ‘All said to him: Allah’s Messenger, you leave me behind along with women and children. Thereupon Allah’s Messenger (may peace be upon him) said to him: Aren’t you satisfied with being unto me what Aaron was unto Moses but with this exception that there is no prophethood after me. And I (also) heard him say on the Day of Khaibar: I would certainly give this standard to a person who loves Allah and his Messenger and Allah and his Messenger love him too. He (the narrator) said: We have been anxiously waiting for it, when he (the Holy Prophet) said: Call ‘Ali. He was called and his eyes were inflamed. He applied saliva to his eyes and handed over the standard to him, and Allah gave him victory. (The third occasion is this) when the (following) verse was revealed:” Let us summon our children and your children.” Allah’s Messenger (may peace be upon him) called ‘Ali, Fitima, Hasan and Husain and said: O Allah, they are my family.

    The last few lines of this tradition are very clear about who the address in surah Aal e imran is about…

    Moving on to the Ahl-al-bait question and about who the “people of the cloak” refers to as mentioned in the question by Yusha sahab and i find the use of the phrase “people of the cloak” to be very appropriate as this following tradition clearly mentions the people of cloak and who they were precisely with reference to the very verse in question.

    SAHIH MUSLIM HADITH NO. 6261:
    A’isha reported that Allah’s Apostle ( ‌صلی ‌اللہ ‌علیہ ‌وسلم ‌ ) went out one morning wearing a striped cloak of the black camel’s hair that there came Hasan b. ‘Ali. He wrapped hitn under it, then came Husain and he wrapped him under it along with the other one (Hasan). Then came Fatima and he took her under it, then came ‘Ali and he also took him under it and then said: Allah only desires to take away any uncleanliness from you, O people of the household, and purify you (thorough purifying)

    ARABIC :
    حَدَّثَنَا أَبُو بَكْرِ بْنُ أَبِي شَيْبَةَ، وَمُحَمَّدُ بْنُ عَبْدِ اللهِ بْنِ نُمَيْرٍ – وَاللَّفْظُ لِأَبِي بَكْرٍ – قَالَا: حَدَّثَنَا مُحَمَّدُ بْنُ بِشْرٍ، عَنْ زَكَرِيَّاءَ، عَنْ مُصْعَبِ بْنِ شَيْبَةَ، عَنْ صَفِيَّةَ بِنْتِ شَيْبَةَ، قَالَتْ: قَالَتْ عَائِشَةُ: خَرَجَ النَّبِيُّ صَلَّى اللهُ عَلَيْهِ وَسَلَّمَ غَدَاةً وَعَلَيْهِ مِرْطٌ مُرَحَّلٌ، مِنْ شَعْرٍ أَسْوَدَ، فَجَاءَ الْحَسَنُ بْنُ عَلِيٍّ فَأَدْخَلَهُ، ثُمَّ جَاءَ الْحُسَيْنُ فَدَخَلَ مَعَهُ، ثُمَّ جَاءَتْ فَاطِمَةُ فَأَدْخَلَهَا، ثُمَّ جَاءَ عَلِيٌّ فَأَدْخَلَهُ، ثُمَّ قَالَ: {إِنَّمَا يُرِيدُ اللهُ لِيُذْهِبَ عَنْكُمُ الرِّجْسَ أَهْلَ الْبَيْتِ وَيُطَهِّرَكُمْ تَطْهِيرًا} [الأحزاب: 33]

    the tradition clearly states who the verse 33 of surah al ahzab refers to…

    Quran should always be the guiding light and it should always be the first book to which shall be the guiding light. However, if the literary meaning of the ayaahs and the interpretation in hadith given by prophet (PBUH) align then how and where can there be any room to find other interpretations?

    I hope my answer assists in the search of truth and does not ignite anything that i do not intend. May Allah guide us all.

    Salam un aleykum.

    • Umer

      Moderator August 28, 2020 at 8:02 pm

      Assalamualikum Qamar Sahab!

      I agree with you on all these narrations and they are very famous ones. But in our discourse (Farahi School), we do not understand Quran from narrations, we first understand it from the ‘kalam’ itself (considering words, sentence structure, context etc.) and if later on, narrations fit perfectly within framework of meaning presented by Quran itself, then those narrations will be accepted without any hesitation, but in cases where narrations go against the meaning portrayed by Quran, then those narrations will be left to further consideration.

      Since in verses of Surah Ahzab, Quran has left no room for any other meaning other than wives of the Prophet (sws), therefore, narrations describing someone else as Ahl-e-Bait will be secondary to the primary category of Ahl-e-Bait put-forth by the Quran itself.

  • Qamar Hashim

    Member August 28, 2020 at 8:34 pm

    Salam Umer Sahab!
    I do know how the Farahi school of thought works and i completely respect it. However, i think Danish sahab has done a thorough analysis and i just added narrations that fit his interpretations. Furthermore, there is a clear distinction between ayaahs before ayat 30 and after it if you read them carefully.

    As in the ayaah 29 there is no “nisa an nabi” used and the ayat continues with the previous use of the word “azwajika”(from 28th ayat) with no change in address. Then why the need to suddenly address the same azwaaj e rasool again in the very next ayat by a different word “nisa an nabi” which as mentioned by Danish sahab is used in surah aal e imran for only hazrat Fatima A.S? We should remember that this is not us who is talking but these are Allah’s words. So why and how does the address in terms of word completely change and yet the same people are addressed (as per your interpretation the wives again)?

    The change in address which is absent in ayat 29 but specifically added in ayat 30 indicates this ayat does not address the same people but indeed some other people are either added to the first ones or the first and second address are for different people.

    Salam un Aleykum

    • Umer

      Moderator August 28, 2020 at 8:50 pm

      I have explained this point in my comment above how we normally use ‘biwiyon’ (wives) and ‘bibiyon’ (women) in the same meaning even in our linguistics and the context makes it clear whether it is the case or not.

      Also in Aal-e-Imran (3:61), there is no specification to women. It is used in general without any specification to Ahl-e-Bait (this could include all women, i.e. wives and daughters and their children). There is no hint (kareena) present in the kalam to use it in meaning of any one specific daughter. Surah Ahzab however, has specified ‘wives of the Prophet (sws)’ and used the term ‘Ahl-e-Bait’ for them therefore, removing any doubt as to who are intended addressees of the verses and who are ‘Ahl-e-Bait’.

    • Qamar Hashim

      Member August 28, 2020 at 9:12 pm

      Yet it is widely narrated that the verse in aal e imran was for the occasion of mubahila and only Hazrat Fatima AS was the lady from prophet’s side. If you claim that some other wives were also there then you should be able to present a verse from quran indicating the exact occasion or a strong tradition in support of your claim. Unfortunately, there isn’t any such incident that indicates your suggestion to the ayat in surah aal e imran.

      And i read your answer and the question still persists with all due respect. As my question is not only about why the word changed from “azwajika” to “nisa an nabi” but my question is also why is there no consistency in ayat 29 and 30th as both are addressed to same people why isn’t “nisa an nabi” also used in ayat 29?
      That is the real question as how come in ayat 29 the verse continues with no change in address and there was suddenly the need felt to address the same wives again and that too with a different word. To my understanding such randomness cannot persist in Allah’s speech and he choses his words with utmost appropriateness and the suggestion that this is randomly used in ayat 30 but not in 29 is something that i can not be satisfied with on a personal level.

      And therefore to me there can be no other interpretation than the interpretation that both addresses are not for the same people, or at least the latter has some additional people included in the address.

      I guess we have all understood each other’s point of view and i respect your opinion. Thanks for taking out time to reading my comments and replying to them.

      Salam un aleykum.

    • $ohail T@hir

      Moderator August 28, 2020 at 8:59 pm

      See this: Discussion 1088

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