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  • Crucifixion Of Christ (Quran 4:157)

    Posted by Arsalan Riaz on December 3, 2020 at 11:13 am

    It is commonly believed in Islamic faith that Jesus Christ was not crucified and someone else or a lookalike was crucified in his place. If that is true then why would Allah make an innocent person a scapegoat ?

    Ahsan replied 3 years, 4 months ago 4 Members · 9 Replies
  • 9 Replies
  • Crucifixion Of Christ (Quran 4:157)

    Ahsan updated 3 years, 4 months ago 4 Members · 9 Replies
  • Arsalan Riaz

    Member December 3, 2020 at 11:27 am

    Her is an excerpt from Al-Tabari:

    Jesus went into a house together with seventeen of his companions. The Jew surrounded them but when they burst in God made all the disciples look like Jesus. The pursuers, supposing that they had bewitched them, threatened to kill them all if they did not expose him. Then Jesus asked his companions which of them would purchase paradise for himself thath day. One man volunteered and went out saying that he was Jesus and as God had made him look like Jesus they took him, killed him and crucified him. Thereupon “a semblance was made to them” and they thought that they had killed Jesus. The Christians likewise thought that it was Jesus who had been killed. And God raised Jesus right away.

  • Ahsan

    Moderator December 3, 2020 at 1:56 pm

    First of all Al-Tabari has used many fabricated hadith and events in the tafsir. I will not consider it a relaible.
    Yes this event has been reported in Tafsir Ibne kasir as well with the reference of Ibn e Abbas.
    Since there is no mention of this event in Quran o sahih hadith, we should not indulge with this kind of petty issues which donot have any value to strengthen our emaan

    • Arsalan Riaz

      Member December 3, 2020 at 2:54 pm

      Surat No 4 : سورة النساء – Ayat No 157
      وَّ قَوۡلِہِمۡ اِنَّا قَتَلۡنَا الۡمَسِیۡحَ عِیۡسَی ابۡنَ مَرۡیَمَ رَسُوۡلَ اللّٰہِ ۚ وَ مَا قَتَلُوۡہُ وَ مَا صَلَبُوۡہُ وَ لٰکِنۡ شُبِّہَ لَہُمۡ ؕ وَ اِنَّ الَّذِیۡنَ اخۡتَلَفُوۡا فِیۡہِ لَفِیۡ شَکٍّ مِّنۡہُ ؕ مَا لَہُمۡ بِہٖ مِنۡ عِلۡمٍ اِلَّا اتِّبَاعَ الظَّنِّ ۚ وَ مَا قَتَلُوۡہُ یَقِیۡنًۢا ﴿۱۵۷﴾ۙ
      And [for] their saying, “Indeed, we have killed the Messiah, Jesus, the son of Mary, the messenger of Allah .” And they did not kill him, nor did they crucify him; but [another] was made to resemble him to them. And indeed, those who differ over it are in doubt about it. They have no knowledge of it except the following of assumption. And they did not kill him, for certain.

      “but another was made to resemble him to them” is used in this verse. Who is this person mentioned here? Was he an innocent person or a criminal or was he Judas Iscariot as many scholars believe him to be ?

    • Faisal Haroon

      Moderator December 3, 2020 at 3:13 pm

      There’s no way for us to know with certainty who that person was.

      God kills many innocent people all the time. The key thing to keep in mind is that this world is not created on the principle of justice – it is created on the principle of test. Justice will be served on the day of judgement, and if the person killed was indeed innocent, he will find a much greater reward for his sacrifice than what he could have achieved in this world.

    • Ahsan

      Moderator December 4, 2020 at 12:53 am

      @Arsal5420
      Thanks for correcting me

  • Umer

    Moderator December 4, 2020 at 4:01 am

    There is no mention in Quran that “another was made to resemble him to them”, in fact it says the matter was made dubious to them [1]. Quran’s statement ended right there and no further explanation was given as to how it was made dubious. The stories we usually hear are rumors and conjectures that mostly migrated from other sects like Christianity and Judaism. And we have no way to ensure veracity of such narratives. In all these matters where Quran is silent, we can express our preference on how things could’ve unfolded based on other external narratives, but we should never present those external narratives as a part of Quran. This demarcation should always be kept in mind. If you consider the incident mentioned in Barnabas, then it seems like no innocent was being killed in the whole incident.

    ___________________________

    [1]

    فَبِمَا نَقْضِهِم مِّيثَاقَهُمْ وَكُفْرِهِم بَآيَاتِ اللّهِ وَقَتْلِهِمُ الأَنْبِيَاء بِغَيْرِ حَقًّ وَقَوْلِهِمْ قُلُوبُنَا غُلْفٌ بَلْ طَبَعَ اللّهُ عَلَيْهَا بِكُفْرِهِمْ فَلاَ يُؤْمِنُونَ إِلاَّ قَلِيلاً وَبِكُفْرِهِمْ وَقَوْلِهِمْ عَلَى مَرْيَمَ بُهْتَانًا عَظِيمًا وَقَوْلِهِمْ إِنَّا قَتَلْنَا الْمَسِيحَ عِيسَى ابْنَ مَرْيَمَ رَسُولَ اللّهِ وَمَا قَتَلُوهُ وَمَا صَلَبُوهُ وَلَـكِن شُبِّهَ لَهُمْ وَإِنَّ الَّذِينَ اخْتَلَفُواْ فِيهِ لَفِي شَكٍّ مِّنْهُ مَا لَهُم بِهِ مِنْ عِلْمٍ إِلاَّ اتِّبَاعَ الظَّنِّ وَمَا قَتَلُوهُ يَقِينًا بَل رَّفَعَهُ اللّهُ إِلَيْهِ وَكَانَ اللّهُ عَزِيزًا حَكِيمًا (١٥٥-١٥٨)

    Then because they broke their covenant [We laid a curse on them] and because they denied the revelations of God and because they killed the prophets unjustly and because they said: “Our hearts have a covering on them.” – [no], in fact, it is God who has sealed their hearts because of their disbelief, so [now] they will seldom embrace faith – and because of their disbelief and vicious accusation against Mary and because of their claim: “We have killed the Messiah, Jesus son of Mary, the Messenger of God.” – even though neither did they kill him nor did they crucify him; in fact, the matter was muddled up to them [11]. Those who are disagreeing in this matter are inflicted with doubt about it; they do have no knowledge about it; they are only following conjectures. They certainly did not slay him; in fact, God lifted him up to him, and God is Mighty and Wise. (4: 155-158)

    (Excerpt from Quranic Exegesis: Javed Ahmed Ghamidi)

    (Translated by Dr. Shehzad Saleem)

    Foot Note:

    [11]. What is meant is that the situation that was created made the Jews believe that they had actually crucified Jesus (sws). What then did actually happen? The most likely of scenarios is the one depicted in the Gospel of Barnabas. As per its account, when Judas Iscariot after being bribed by the chief priest of the Jews came over with some guards to arrest Jesus (sws), four angels at the behest of the Almighty took him away and transformed the voice and face of Judas into exactly those of Jesus (sws). It was he who was crucified. No one was able to even touch Jesus (sws). It is while pointing to this scenario that perhaps the Quran has dubbed it as being made muddled up for the Jews.

    • Ahsan

      Moderator December 4, 2020 at 11:31 am

      Thank you Umair Sb for clarifying.

      About Barnabas gospel, although it contains things narrative similar to general muslim but i have read works of christian scholars where they discredit it by saying it as fabrication.
      Do you think its a good idea to give reference from there?

    • Umer

      Moderator December 4, 2020 at 6:35 pm

      This was a reference for Muslims just as to what Ghamidi Sahab thinks could be plausible (not a statement of fact). As long as we are distinguishing clearly between what is written in Quran and what is written in any external source of information, a scholar can use any reference which he thinks could be plausible according to him and doesn’t stand in open contradiction with Quran. There is no need to present this as an argument to non-Muslims.

  • Ahsan

    Moderator December 4, 2020 at 11:31 pm

    OK thanks

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