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  • Can God Do Anything?

    Posted by Ahmad Shoaib on December 16, 2020 at 4:11 pm

    Take the classical can God create a rock he can’t lift? Or can God create another God?

    Do these all come under وما أوتيتم من العلم إلا قليلا?

    Umer replied 3 years, 2 months ago 7 Members · 19 Replies
  • 19 Replies
  • Can God Do Anything?

    Umer updated 3 years, 2 months ago 7 Members · 19 Replies
  • Ahmad Shoaib

    Contributor December 16, 2020 at 4:14 pm

    And how does this hold up with Allah being قدير على كل شيئ?

    • Sheharbano Ali

      Member December 16, 2020 at 5:32 pm

      Isn’t this the answer to the above also? قدير على كل شيئ Because of His Being existing from Awal to Akhir and Zahir to Batin, so His Qudrat would also be above all.

      Also, what would ‘lift’ imply here? All that exists is His Knowledge. All that exists and will exist is a manifestation of His Knowledge. And that rock never existed. This is what made Him the First and The Last. And this is what makes His names/attributes testify to this very fact. Al Qadir then would only suffice as His name if there isn’t a rock that He couldn’t lift.

      I think.

  • Faisal Haroon

    Moderator December 16, 2020 at 6:24 pm

    What makes you think that God wouldn’t be able to create a rock that He can’t lift?

    • Ahmad Shoaib

      Contributor December 16, 2020 at 8:27 pm

      Because then if he created such a rock he would not be على كل شيئ قدير

    • Faisal Haroon

      Moderator December 16, 2020 at 8:44 pm

      He can create a rock that He can’t lift, but then lift it as well. Of course it’s not logical, but that only explains the limitations of our logic – not the omnipotence of God.

    • Ahmad Shoaib

      Contributor December 16, 2020 at 8:45 pm

      Limitations of our human logic in comparison to the being of God

    • Sheharbano Ali

      Member December 17, 2020 at 5:12 am

      He would have to create another creation like us who cannot lift the rock. So the rock is being lifted (by Him) and not being lifted at the same time. Two realities are being achieved at the same time just to point towards One.

    • Sheharbano Ali

      Member December 17, 2020 at 4:42 am

      If he could ‘create’ that rock why wouldn’t He be able to lift it? Im sure we’re not implying the physical act of lifting here? If He could ‘create’ the very material that makes it hard to lift the rock, why wouldn’t He be able to lift it?

      And so i also think the example of robots and humans isn’t correct because we’re only creating from what pre existed. Then there are external factors that pre existed too. In the case of God, all of that is going to flow from Him. So i dont get it. @AhmadShoaib

    • Ahmad Shoaib

      Contributor December 17, 2020 at 9:54 am

      I think the principle of limited logic is strong enough

  • ودود

    Member December 16, 2020 at 8:26 pm

    We can ask an other similar question to help answer the above question:

    Can a man invent a robot that enslaves its inventor?

    • Ahmad Shoaib

      Contributor December 16, 2020 at 8:27 pm

      Perhaps

  • ودود

    Member December 16, 2020 at 8:29 pm

    Right. In other words even if he can he wont.

    This is also the answer to your question.

    • Ahmad Shoaib

      Contributor December 16, 2020 at 8:31 pm

      ‘Even if he can he won’t’ so we simply don’t know? We can’t comprehend the being of God so I guess it comes under that

  • ودود

    Member December 16, 2020 at 8:35 pm

    Yes i think so.

    There are many un-Godly acts that God wont do such as breaking a promise, be unfair to anyone, tell a lie etc.

    creating a rock bigger than what he can lift or other similar hypothetical questions also fall under the category of “un-Godly acts — i suppose.

    • Ahmad Shoaib

      Contributor December 16, 2020 at 8:37 pm

      I think they lying and being unfair is easily answered as it doesn’t contain a fallacy.

      For example, lying is only done in problems or times where you have to lie out of need, or if you are greedy. Al-Ghaniy is never in those situations.

      But the questions like creating a married bachelor or a square circle I guess you could say is just a logical fallacy.

      Same with a rock being heavier than God.

      Also this rock question introduces anthropomorphism to God- assigning him a space and a time which the Quran rejects

  • ودود

    Member December 16, 2020 at 11:42 pm

    Yes agree God exists in a different state free of cause and effect laws of this universe and therefore the attributes like “bigger”, “greater” or “heavier” etc are not even relevant or applicable.

  • Ahsan

    Moderator December 17, 2020 at 12:44 pm

    @AhmadShoaib I think ur opinion of logical fallacy is more appropriate then any other answer as these type of question are ratinally meaningless

  • Nadeem Minhas

    Member December 17, 2020 at 4:04 pm

    This is a trick question where the person posing the question sets a basis that God can do everything and then asks to break the same base he setup in the first place. So it is not a correct question. Following the base of this question, God can make as big of a rock as he wishes and he can lift it too. There is no other choice.

  • Umer

    Moderator December 17, 2020 at 5:30 pm

    For comments of Ghamidi Sahab to the ‘Stone Paradox’ Question, please refer to the following link from 26:57 to 29:46

    (*You can use the alternative link provided at the end of the video separately in case the primary video doesn’t work for you)

    Discussion 1630 • Reply 1637

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