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  • Believing While Not Being Satisfied

    Posted by Muhammad Talha on May 24, 2022 at 3:58 pm

    What should one do when he knows that God exists but cannot make peace with the way his ‘examination’ is designed? When all he has seen is suffering, oppression? What should one do when even after trying to convince himself that all this is a test, his inner self accepts all of it as cruelty?

    Should one believe in this concept of test and the afterlife even though his innerself/heart/reason isn’t convinced? Would that be hypocrisy if someone doesn’t truly believe that because their brain doesn’t accept it as true and still wants to be Muslim?

    Umer replied 1 year, 11 months ago 5 Members · 9 Replies
  • 9 Replies
  • Believing While Not Being Satisfied

    Umer updated 1 year, 11 months ago 5 Members · 9 Replies
  • Faraz Siddiqui

    Member May 24, 2022 at 7:14 pm

    So sorry to hear that u have had nothing but difficulties, may Allah provide you with ease. Yes, problems, disappointments, betrayal heart us to our core. Although logic and reason understand but the heart refuses to accept and question’s morality and purpose of this life.

    1. Keep fighting and trying is the only solution, there’s no shortcut

    2. Problems r part and parcel of life, there’s no measure that can tell us precisely if we have equal problems like others

    3. From problems and hardships comes success and serenity, only losers have no issues

    4. Write down your problems in a chronological order and also write down problems u don’t have, you’ll see that u r not dealt with the worst hand

    5. Read biographies of rich and famous, learn from the lessons they learnt

    6. Establish a living relationship with quran, contemplate on the issues prophets went through. Imagine Moses AS thrown out of life of luxury to life of exile and a status of fugitive. Whole quran doesn’t mention a single event where Moses AS was not in somekind of pain or disappointment

    7. Read Seerat, Muhammad SAW suffered the most, imagine ur uncle celebrating that your son has died!

    8. Don’t dwell on the notion of test and fate, no one can give u an absolute answer, all we can do is to strive as hard as we can and thats it

    Hope this helps, insha Allah

  • Faisal Haroon

    Moderator May 24, 2022 at 8:13 pm

    The very first thing that one should do is to read and understand any good translation of the Quran from cover to cover.

    Secondly, one should contemplate and reason with his own self to figure out how any pain and suffering might subside by not believing in God’s scheme? Also is there an alternative ideology out there grounded in knowledge that’s better than the Quran?

    If after reading and understanding the Quran, one does in fact sincerely believe that there’s something better out there, I agree that it would be hypocritical to keep believing in the Quran.

    From personal experience, I can tell you that the problem is generally not the pain and the suffering in the world. Deep down the real problem lies in lack of knowledge or understanding, and sometimes even arrogance that hides behind excuses to not to believe.

    • Muhammad Talha

      Member May 25, 2022 at 6:46 am

      Example:

      When someone has bipolar, multiple sclerosis, terminal cancer at 25 years old, had an abusive childhood, it is easier to accept that one was dealt with a bad set of genes rather than thinking of all that as a ‘test’ from a merciful God. And it is even more challenging when the person going through it has never wronged anyone and gone above and beyond to help people in every capacity. If this is not unfair then I don’t know what is.

      Please tell me what should such a person ‘contemplate’ and ‘understand’.

    • Faisal Haroon

      Moderator May 25, 2022 at 9:35 am

      I’m not sure what’s the material difference in the impact of suffering assuming that someone was dealt with a bad set of genes as opposed to knowing that it’s a test from God. In fact the latter case is more optimistic in knowing that this is just a temporary phase and should they remain steadfast while doing the best that they can, they shall be immensely rewarded with an eternal reward.

  • Faraz Siddiqui

    Member May 25, 2022 at 8:31 am

    Would this person’s perspective change if he learns

    1. His bipolar has saved him from abusing drugs, major depression and drug induced psychosis

    2. MS has saved him being crippled and paralyzed due to a motorcycle accident

    3. Terminal cancer has saved him from a life of sin and ignorance, result of which is only eternal hell

    Brother, the assumption that Allah is ONLY merciful when He does what’s pleasing to oneself or according to his/her plans is a false notion. Mercy is also saving from bigger and long lasting suffering and pain, particularly pain that will lead to ignorance.

    Besides, if this person doesn’t have all these ailments, what evidence do we have that he would’ve had a fuller, happier and successful life? Thousands of people who have none of these issues ruin their lives for nothing.

    Lastly, this world isn’t a place of judgement neither people reward u for your good deeds. Whatever good one does, he/she will see it in this world and in the next

    Read surah Kahaf, contemplate on Moses AS and Khazir story, all calamities befalls you, through no fault of your own, they are either to save u from some bigger problem in this world or from damnation in the next

    • Muhammad Talha

      Member May 26, 2022 at 7:16 am

      The logic is so flawed, may be the bipolar prevented him from discovering a cure for some lethal disease.

      MS prevented him from taking care of his family.

      Cancer cut short his life which would have been otherwise served in helping and taking care of people.

      The logic that you have quoted hold no objective value.

    • Aayan Zubairi

      Member May 26, 2022 at 2:02 pm

      Salam,

      Well to begin with, let’s first contemplate upon what God has said, the Quran. Read the Quran, ponder over it. Try to contemplate what the verses mean. Go through it leaving bias aside and analyse the book of God.

      Secondly the set of circumstances you mentioned above, and as @faraz siddiqui pointed out, each of them has a positive impact that you can’t see at present. This may seem to be a fallacy to some, however when one realises that whatever happens indeed happens by the will of God, God who acts with wisdom and knowledge makes it happen for a reason, and then when one realises that human knowledge is relative (we are not omnipotent we do not know the future, nor do we know every aspect of the past and present) we begin to understand.

      When one argues that “life isn’t a test”, what they’re doing is letting a bias hinder their objectivity leading them to becoming subjective and this is the test. The problems you mentioned above happen for two basic reason the first to test one’s strenth in regards to faith and conduct, and for another purpose unknown to us.

      I hope this helps.

    • Faraz Siddiqui

      Member May 26, 2022 at 7:13 pm

      Brother its all about perspective, truth and reality are relative

      Same can be said about your logic. Most young people don’t do stuff that u mentioned, statistically speaking, scenarios i mentioned are far more likely.

      You and i both have no way to find out alternative reality. Our nafs always tells us that if this or that issue didn’t exist then it wouldve been wonderful and rosy. We fail to realize that there’s no objective evidence for it and it could be worse as much as it could be better.

      Brother Faisal pointed out a good question, how would anything change if the sufferer deny Allah? No pain will be less and no problem will solve

      Rethink your ideas that Allah’s mercy means enjoyment, ease and fulfillment of desires. Allah is always merciful, sometimes in our present and sometimes in our future. We can’t see the future neither we know what we will do in certain circumstance. Problems we face tend to keep us away from making wrong choices in our present so our future could be better.

      It’s hard to keep eman during pain and suffering, it’s ok if the faith feels weak, sahab RA felt the same uncertainty during hardship. Key is not to lose hope and keep doing good. Allah rewards for good deeds and not people, do good for yourself and not for others

  • Umer

    Moderator May 27, 2022 at 8:16 am

    Please also see:

    Discussion 48007

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