Ask Ghamidi

A Community Driven Discussion Portal
To Ask, Answer, Share And Learn

Forums Forums Sources of Islam A Person Asked From The Grave Of The Prophet (SWS) For The Rain During Famine

  • A Person Asked From The Grave Of The Prophet (SWS) For The Rain During Famine

    Posted by Abdul on July 24, 2023 at 6:06 am

    Some people with this hadith try to prove the permission of Waseela, How reliable this hadith is?

    Proof of Waseela from Sahih Hadees.

    Front Cover: Al-Musannaf Ibn Abi Shaybah, Publish by Maqtabah ar-Rashid, Riyadh, Saudia Arabia
    Malik ad-Dar i.e. treasurer of Umar (ra) relates: The people were gripped by famine during the tenure of Umar (Ibn-ul- Khattab). Then a man walked up to the grave of Prophet and said: O Messenger of Allah! ask for rain from Allah for your Ummah who is in dire straits. Then he saw the Prophet (saw) in dream. The Prophet (saw) said to him, Go over to Umar, give him my regards and tell him that the rain will come to you. And tell Umar that he should be on his toes, he should be on his toes (he should remain alert). He went over to see Umar and passed on to him the tidings. On hearing this, Umar broke into a spurt of crying. He said, O Allah, I exert myself to the full until I am completely exhausted.
    References
    Al-Musannaf Ibn Abi Shaybah Volume 011, Page No. 118, Hadith Number 32538
    This Hadith is authenticated as **Sahih** by
    ➤Imam Ibn Kathir in Al Bidayah Wan Nihayah Volume No. 5, Page No. 167
    -Imam Qastallani in al-Mawahib-ul-laduniyyah (4:276)
    Ibn-e-Taymiya in Fi-lqtida-as-Sirat-il-Mustaqim (Vol.1, Page 373)

    Umer replied 1 year, 4 months ago 2 Members · 1 Reply
  • 1 Reply
  • A Person Asked From The Grave Of The Prophet (SWS) For The Rain During Famine

    Umer updated 1 year, 4 months ago 2 Members · 1 Reply
  • Umer

    Moderator July 25, 2023 at 10:23 pm

    It must be kept in mind that these are historical narrations (akhbar-i-ahad) which are reports of people and hence there is no way for us to declare such a narration as completely authentic. If such narrations relate to religious matters or are attributed to Prophet Muhammad (SWS) (Most commonly known as Hadith) then we have certain principles which are very thorough and rigorous to achieve reasonable sense of credibility and among them, the strength of the chain of narrators hold the primary position (Please see: Discussion 56230).

    For historical narrations other than hadith narrations, other tools are deployed to identify whether such narrations could be credible or not, like considering the reasonableness of the nature of information within holistic framework of history of that particular time. In matters of reported historical events, the content of the narration, its placement in the holistic framework of history, reason and logic etc. hold the primary position, while the chain of narrators hold the secondary position. (Please refer to the video response by Ghamidi Sahab in the [Foot Note 1] and for further details, refer to the detailed discussions of Ghamidi Sahab in the following thread: Discussion 77513).

    As a general principle, it must also be kept in mind that matters of religion and religious practices are not to be extracted from isolated events reported by few people. Instead, the whole of religion has been securely transmitted to us through Quran and Sunnah, and all religious matters first need to be established from Quran and Sunnah, and if any narration goes against these primary sources of religion, then that narration cannot be accepted, even if its chain of transmission is sound and healthy. For general comments of Ghamidi Sahab on the concept of Wasila, please refer to the following threads:

    Discussion 40219

    Discussion 30955

    Discussion on the Narration under Consideration:

    While keeping in mind that this narration relates to the depiction of a historical event and is not included in any of the primary books of Hadith. The earliest references of this narration can be found in:

    Musanaf ibn-e-Abi Shaiba (d: 235H), Number 34170 (18/31, Dar-ul-Kanuz, Riyadh Al-Saudia)

    Tarikh-ul-Kabir by Ibn-e-Abi Khaithma (d: 279H), Number 1818 (2/80, Al-Faruq-ul Haditha, Cairo Egypt)

    The Chain of Narrators:

    Prominent hadith scholars like Hafiz ibn-e-Hajr Asqalani (Fath-ul-Bari 2/495, Dar-ul-Marfa Beirut), Ibn-e-Kathir (Al-Badaya Wa Nahaya 10/74, Dar-ul-Alam ul Kutab Riyadh AND Masnad Al-Faruq 1/223, Dar-ul-Wafa Al-Mansura), Ibn-e-Taimiya (Iqtiza Al-Sirat al Mustaqim 2/254, Dar-ul-Alam ul Kutab, Beirut) have categorized the chain of this narration as Sahih (Although Ibn-e-Taimiya has not specifically commented on the chain, rather his comments are in a different context), but at the same time, following scholars have raised concerns on the chain of narrators of this narration:

    – Researcher of Musanaf Ibn-e-Abi Shaiba under whose research this book is published, Abu Habib Al-Shahshri writes:

    معلول، والصواب أنه مرسل، قال الخليلي في الإرشاد 1/ 316: (يقال إن أبا صالح سمع مالك الدار هذا الحديث والباقون أرسلوه)، ومالك الدار هو مالك بن عياض المدني مولى عمر، وثقه ابن حبان، وروى عنه جمع

    Malul (Problem in the Hadith because of some illat), and the correct view is that it is Mursal (Broken Chain). Al-Khalili (d: 446H) said in Al-Irshad 1/316: (‘It is said that Abu Salih heard this hadith from Malik Ad-Dar, and the rest transmitted from that’). And Malik Ad-Dar is Malik bin Ayadh Al-Madni, the mawla of Umar, and Ibn Hibban trusted him, and a collection narrated from him”.

    Musanaf ibn-e-Abi Shaiba (18/31, Dar-ul-Kanuz, Riyadh Al-Saudia)

    Shiekh Albani has criticized the chain of this narration quite vehemently, please refer to English translation of his book “Al-Tawassul” at the following link below from pages 119 to 123 specifically:

    https://archive.org/details/TawassulShaykhNasruddinAlbani/page/n127/mode/2up

    Sahih Bukhari depicts a different picture:

    While Sahih Bukhari depicts a different picture through a different chain from Anas bin Malik (rta) where everyone prayed to Allah for rain, including caliph Umar (rta) and he specifically asked Abbas (rta) to also pray to Allah for the rain. There is no mention of asking of Wasila from the grave of Prophet Muhammad. Instead, Abbas (rta) was asked to Pray for the rain in the absence of Prophet Muhammad (SWS).

    Bukhari 1010: https://sunnah.com/bukhari:1010

    Ibn-e-Taimiya writes:

    أن قصد القبور للدعاء عندها، ورجاء الإجابة بالدعاء هنالك رجاء أكثر من رجائها بالدعاء في غير ذلك الموطن، أمر لم يشرعه الله ولا رسوله ولا فعله أحد من الصحابة ولا التابعين، ولا أئمة المسلمين ولا ذكره أحد من العلماء ولا الصالحين المتقدمين، بل أكثر ما ينقل من ذلك عن بعض المتأخرين بعد المائة الثانية.

    وأصحاب رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلم قد أجدبوا مرات، ودهمتهم نوائب غير ذلك، فهلا جاءوا فاستسقوا واستغاثوا، عند قبر النبي صلى الله عليه وسلم؟

    بل خرج ‌عمر ‌بالعباس فاستسقى به ولم يستسق عند قبر النبي صلى الله عليه وسلم.

    بل قد روي عن عائشة رضي الله عنها أنها كشفت عن قبر النبي صلى الله عليه وسلم لينزل المطر، فإنه رحمة تنزل على قبره ولم تستسق عنده ولا استغاثت هناك

    Going to graves to offer supplication beside them, and seeking a response to dua offered there more than dua offered elsewhere, is something that was not prescribed by Allah or His Messenger, and was not done by any of the Sahabah, Tabaen or imams of the Muslims. It was not mentioned by any of the earlier scholars or righteous men. Rather most of what has been narrated concerning that comes from some of the later figures, after the second century (AH).

    The companions of the Messenger of Allah (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) were faced with drought several times, and other calamities befell them, but did they come and seek rain and seek help at the grave of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him)?

    Rather Umar (rta) went out with Al-Abbas and sought rain through him, (i.e. through his dua); he did not pray for rain by the grave of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him).

    Indeed, it was narrated from Aisha (may Allah be pleased with her) that she uncovered the grave of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) so that rain might fall on it, because it (rain) is a mercy, but she did not pray for rain there, or seek divine help there”.

    (Iqtiza Al-Sirat al Mustaqim 2/197, Dar-ul-Alam ul Kutab, Beirut)

    He also writes:

    فلما عدلوا عن التوسل به إلى التوسل

    بالعباس: علم أن ما يفعل في حياته قد تعذر بموته؛ بخلاف التوسل الذي هو الإيمان به والطاعة له فإنه مشروع دائما

    When they replaced using the Prophet as a means for using Al-Abbas instead, it was understood that what they did in his life became impossible after his death, unlike using him as a means by having faith in him and obeying him, which are legislated for all times.

    (Majmu Al-Fatawa 1/201-202, Majma-ul-Malik Fahd, Medina, Saudia)

    Ibn-e-Hajr Asqalani writes:

    وقد روى عبد الرزاق من حديث بن عباس أن عمر استسقى بالمصلى فقال للعباس قم فاستسق فقام العباس فذكر الحديث فتبين بهذا أن في القصة المذكورة أن العباس كان مسئولا وأنه ينزل منزلة الإمام إذا أمره الإمام بذلك

    Abd al-Razzaq narrated from the hadith of Ibn Abbas that Umar prayed for rain and said to al-Abbas to Get up and make dua for rain, so Al-Abbas got up. It is evident from this hadith that in the aforementioned incident Al-Abbas was responsible and that he would occupy the position of the imam if the imam ordered him to do so”.

    (Fath-ul-Bari 2/495, Dar-ul-Marfa Beirut)

    Early History Book gives an entirely different picture of the Incident:

    Early History Book Tarikh-e-Tabri provides complete picture of this incident and helps in bridging the gap between the nature of incidents mentioned in Sahih Bukhari and Musanaf Ibn-e-Abi Shaiba. Although the chains of narrators are weak, but these narrations provide a holistic picture of this historical event and also help in eradicating any apparent contradictions reported in this event through different chains.

    Following is the relevant text:

    عبد الرحمن بن كعب بن مالك، قال: كانت في آخر سنة سبع عشرة وأول سنه ثمان عشره، وكانت الرمادة جوعا أصاب الناس بالمدينة وما حولها فأهلكهم حتى جعلت الوحش تأوي إلى الإنس، وحتى جعل الرجل يذبح الشاة فيعافها من قبحها، وإنه لمقفر.

    كتب إلي السري، عن شعيب، عن سيف، عن سهل بن يوسف، عن عبد الرحمن بن كعب، قال: كان الناس بذلك وعمر كالمحصور عن أهل الأمصار، حتى أقبل بلال بن الحارث المزني، فاستأذن عليه، فقال:

    أنا رسول رسول الله إليك، يقول لك رسول الله ص: لقد عهدتك كيسا، وما زلت على رجل، فما شأنك! فقال: متى رأيت هذا؟

    قال: البارحة، فخرج فنادى في الناس: الصلاة جامعة! فصلى بهم ركعتين

    ثم قام فقال: أيها الناس، أنشدكم الله، هل تعلمون مني أمرا غيره خير منه؟ قالوا: اللهم لا، قال: فإن بلال بن الحارث يزعم ذية وذية، فقالوا:

    صدق بلال، فاستغث بالله وبالمسلمين، فبعث إليهم- وكان عمر عن ذلك محصورا- فقال عمر: الله أكبر! بلغ البلاء مدته فانكشف، ما أذن لقوم في الطلب إلا وقد رفع عنهم البلاء، فكتب إلى أمراء الأمصار:

    أغيثوا أهل المدينة ومن حولها، فإنه قد بلغ جهدهم، وأخرج الناس إلى الاستسقاء، فخرج وخرج معه بالعباس ماشيا، فخطب فأوجز، ثم صلى، ثم جثا لركبتيه، وقال: اللهم إياك نعبد وإياك نستعين، اللهم اغفر لنا وارحمنا وارض عنا ثم انصرف، فما بلغوا المنزل راجعين حتى خاضوا الغدران كتب إلي السري، عن شعيب، عن سيف، عن مبشر بن الفضيل، عن جبير بن صخر، عن عاصم بن عمر بن الخطاب، قال: قحط الناس زمان عمر عاما، فهزل المال، فقال أهل بيت من مزينة من أهل البادية لصاحبهم: قد بلغنا، فاذبح لنا شاة، قال: ليس فيهن شيء، فلم يزالوا به حتى ذبح لهم شاة، فسلخ عن عظم أحمر، فنادى: يا محمداه! فأري فيما يرى النائم ان رسول الله ص أتاه، فقال: أبشر بالحيا! ائت عمر فأقرئه مني السلام، وقل له: إن عهدي بك وأنت وفي العهد، شديد العقد، فالكيس الكيس يا عمر! فجاء حتى أتى باب عمر، فقال لغلامه:

    استاذن لرسول رسول الله ص، فأتى عمر فأخبره، ففزع وقال:

    رأيت به مسا! قال: لا، قال: فأدخله، فدخل فأخبره الخبر، فخرج فنادى في الناس، وصعد المنبر، وقال: أنشدكم بالذي هداكم للإسلام، هل رأيتم مني شيئا تكرهونه! قالوا: اللهم لا، قالوا: ولم ذاك؟ فأخبرهم، ففطنوا ولم يفطن، فقالوا: إنما استبطأك في الاستسقاء، فاستسق بنا، فنادى في الناس، فقام فخطب فأوجز، ثم صلى ركعتين فأوجز، ثم قال:

    اللهم عجزت عنا أنصارنا، وعجز عنا حولنا وقوتنا، وعجزت عنا أنفسنا

    ولا حول ولا قوة إلا بك، اللهم فاسقنا، وأحي العباد والبلاد

    [Tarikh-e-Tabri (d: 310H) 4/98-100 (Dar-ul-Muarif, Egypt)]

    For translation of the above text, please refer to the attached images (three separate image files).

    Conclusion:

    In the light of the above references, a clear picture emerges where instead of asking wasila from the grave of Prophet Muhammad (sws), Umar (rta) had used Salah and Dua to beseech Allah for the rain and even the dreams of Prophet Muhammad (sws) shown to one person, gave the same message to the Caliph Umar (rta) to offer Salah and pray to the Almighty for the rain, with the glad tiding that if this course is followed then surely Allah will bless them with rain. It seems a very unacademic approach to extract the whole concept of Wasila from an isolated narration whose chain is itself hanging by the thread while surrounded by contradictory reports of the same incident.

    __

    [Foot Note 1]

    Please refer to the video below from 1:09:21 to 1:12:08

    https://youtu.be/u9S64cSYaUg?t=4161

The discussion "A Person Asked From The Grave Of The Prophet (SWS) For The Rain During Famine" is closed to new replies.

Start of Discussion
0 of 0 replies June 2018
Now