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  • کرامات

    Posted by Mohammad Saad on September 10, 2020 at 8:01 pm

    I had a discussion with a fellow regarding کرامات, I presented the Hadees saying that “nothing is left of prophetism except Al-Mubashirat”, and I made the point that such things are only specific to the Prophets.

    But my fellow based his point on the following Ayah:

    القرآن

    سورۃ نمبر 27 النمل

    آیت نمبر 40

    أَعـوذُ بِاللهِ مِنَ الشَّيْـطانِ الرَّجيـم

    بِسْمِ اللّٰهِ الرَّحْمٰنِ الرَّحِيْمِ

    قَالَ الَّذِىۡ عِنۡدَهٗ عِلۡمٌ مِّنَ الۡـكِتٰبِ اَنَا اٰتِيۡكَ بِهٖ قَبۡلَ اَنۡ يَّرۡتَدَّ اِلَيۡكَ طَرۡفُكَ‌ؕ فَلَمَّا رَاٰهُ مُسۡتَقِرًّا عِنۡدَهٗ قَالَ هٰذَا مِنۡ فَضۡلِ رَبِّىۡ‌ۖ لِيَبۡلُوَنِىۡٓ ءَاَشۡكُرُ اَمۡ اَكۡفُرُ‌ؕ وَمَنۡ شَكَرَ فَاِنَّمَا يَشۡكُرُ لِنَفۡسِهٖ‌ۚ وَمَنۡ كَفَرَ فَاِنَّ رَبِّىۡ غَنِىٌّ كَرِيۡمٌ ۞

    ترجمہ:

    جس کے پاس کتاب کا علم تھا اس نے کہا، میں اس کو آپ کی پلک جھپکنے سے پہلے حاضر کردوں گا۔ پس اس نے اس کو اپنے سامنے موجود دیکھا تو اس نے کہا یہ میرے رب کا فضل ہے تاکہ وہ میرا امتحان کرے کہ میں شکر کرتا ہوں یا ناشکری کرتا ہوں اور جو شکر کرتا ہے تو اپنے ہی نفع کے لئے شکر کرتا ہے اور جس نے ناشکری کی تو میرا رب بےنیاز و کریم ہے

    He said it was a کرامت of that scholar which proves that it isn’t something specific to the Prophets only and so the Hadees in discussion doesn’t apply here.

    Kindly elaborate it

    Saira Qureshi replied 3 years, 10 months ago 4 Members · 15 Replies
  • 15 Replies
  • misbah imad

    Member September 10, 2020 at 8:37 pm

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GC_qyF2wVRI

    ye video hay hi 5 mins ki, Is video ke aakhri hissey me aap ke sawaal ka jawab hay, ghamidi sahab ne wahi aayat ka hawala dia hay…

    • Mohammad Saad

      Member September 10, 2020 at 9:57 pm

      So why can’t we say that Sufis or اولیاء also had such knowledge? Why does Ghamidi sb say that these are just stories and lies and not that knowledge?

    • misbah imad

      Member September 11, 2020 at 12:48 am

      II don’t think you heard him correctly. Its a 5 min video. Go through it again. He never said everything about the sufis was a lie…

    • Mohammad Saad

      Member September 11, 2020 at 12:54 am

      I’m not talking about this particular video. I’m saying that as Imam Muslim stated: “Sufia ki zuban sy jhoot nikalta hy” or something like that and ghamidi sb also quotes him. Why don’t they just believe that it is some other knowledge on which they have no grasp instead of saying it was a lie.

      And secondly, I can justify any “کرامت” on this idea that it was some inner knowledge (and you know people believe in many ridiculous stories)

    • misbah imad

      Member September 11, 2020 at 1:02 am

      ghamidi sahab says exactly that it is something else, which is not from Allah, because according to him, the doors for that are closed after Rasoolallah…

      What he says is that calling such “spiritual experiences”, something coming from Allah is a lie.

      He does not deny the experiences themselves….

    • Mohammad Saad

      Member September 11, 2020 at 1:07 am

      JazakAllah khair

  • misbah imad

    Member September 11, 2020 at 1:07 am

    An important shortcoming of people like ghamidi sahab is that the sometimes forget everyone else in the world is not capable of understanding what they convey….

    Thats why, I listened to several videos of his to understand his thought and check for any inconsistencies…

    • Mohammad Saad

      Member September 11, 2020 at 1:10 am

      Yeah, I too listen to his videos or Dr Shehzad Saleem’s videos to clearly understand the point

  • Faisal Haroon

    Moderator September 11, 2020 at 1:21 am

    The correct translation for the word kitab in 27:40 is law, not book/revelation.

    Ghamidi sahab doesn’t deny the existence of such knowledge, however, it has nothing to do with deen. I’m posting below some other discussions on tassawuf that might help clarify.

  • Faisal Haroon

    Moderator September 11, 2020 at 1:23 am

    Please see:

    Discussion 4851

  • Faisal Haroon

    Moderator September 11, 2020 at 1:26 am

    Also see:

    Discussion 29291

    • Mohammad Saad

      Member September 11, 2020 at 1:34 am

      JazakAllah khair

    • Mohammad Saad

      Member September 11, 2020 at 1:38 am

      There’s one last confusion.

      Now I’m not talking about Sufis, I’m talking about other اولیاء, the followers of many اولیاء believe that they had the same power and abilities (کرامات) that Allah had given that person under discussion in Surah Naml Ayat 40.

      They argue that if Allah provided him with such abilities, why can’t Allah provide such abilities now? I mean they justify many stories about اولیاء on this argument

    • misbah imad

      Member September 11, 2020 at 2:05 am

      Of course such people could exist today, but does that power mean that it would have something to do with being a better muslim than others ? Certainly not. Its an ability like other abilities. It has mean that a person who is a better level of faith in Allah will have such powers.

  • Saira Qureshi

    Member September 11, 2020 at 8:20 am

    جو مجھے بات سمجھ آتی ہے غامدی صاحب کو سننے کے بعد وہ یہ ہے کہ یہ “ نفسانی علوم ہیں” اور جن لوگوں میں قدرتی طور سے یہ علم حاصل کرنے کی صلاحیت ہوتی ہے وہ اسے آسانی سے حاصل کر لیتے ہیں۔ اسکا مطلب یہ نہیں کہ یہ لوگ اللہ سے زیادہ قریب ہو جاتے ہیں اور فرشتے اور اللہ تک رسائی حاصل کر لیتے ہیں۔ یہ دعوی ختم نبوت کے خلاف جے ۔ میں نے اس بحص پہ غامدی صاحب کی سینکڑوں ویڈیوز دیکھیں ہیں

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