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  • Forgives All Other Than Shirk – Quran 4:116

    Posted by Ahmad Shoaib on October 23, 2020 at 12:57 pm

    An-Nisa’ – 4:116

    Arabic

    إِنَّ ٱللَّهَ لَا يَغۡفِرُ أَن يُشۡرَكَ بِهِۦ وَيَغۡفِرُ مَا دُونَ ذَٰلِكَ لِمَن يَشَآءُۚ وَمَن يُشۡرِكۡ بِٱللَّهِ فَقَدۡ ضَلَّ ضَلَٰلًۢا بَعِيدًا

    Does that mean that God could forgive huqooq ul ibaad?

    Ghamidi sahab often says this verse means ‘knowingly does shirk’. Where does the interpretation come from that allows the word ‘knowingly’ to be used?

    Umer replied 3 years, 4 months ago 2 Members · 13 Replies
  • 13 Replies
  • Forgives All Other Than Shirk – Quran 4:116

    Umer updated 3 years, 4 months ago 2 Members · 13 Replies
  • Umer

    Moderator October 23, 2020 at 4:12 pm

    If you look at the flow of verses [1], they were talking about munafiqeen (hypocrites) who joined with the cause of mushriks (idolators) who were knowingly engaged in open shirk as their religion and then Quran says that this shirk, the one practiced by idolators of Arab is unforgivable. Therefore, this automatically follows, that it has to be with a conscious knowledge. This is also reflected in God’s punishment under itmam-e-hujjah where people of the book and Idolators of Arab were separated despite the fact their crime was same i.e. rejecting a rasul and insisting on their polytheism, but due to the fact that conditions of perpetrators differ in their manifestation of this shirk, the former were given a comparatively lower punishment. The same can be inferred for what will happen on the day of judgement. This is a crime solely associated with God and God has clarified that it is unforgivable. But the case with haqooq-ul-ibaad is different, it adds an additional party on whom the crime happened, therefore, it leaves open the possibility of forgiveness in this case. But it will all be done in accordance with the laws mentioned clearly by God himself and Justice is an absolute clause in every case.

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    [1]

    وَمَن يُشَاقِقِ الرَّسُولَ مِن بَعْدِ مَا تَبَيَّنَ لَهُ الْهُدَى وَيَتَّبِعْ غَيْرَ سَبِيلِ الْمُؤْمِنِينَ نُوَلِّهِ مَا تَوَلَّى وَنُصْلِهِ جَهَنَّمَ وَسَاءتْ مَصِيرًا

    إِنَّ اللّهَ لاَ يَغْفِرُ أَن يُشْرَكَ بِهِ وَيَغْفِرُ مَا دُونَ ذَلِكَ لِمَن يَشَاء وَمَن يُشْرِكْ بِاللّهِ فَقَدْ ضَلَّ ضَلاَلاً بَعِيدًا

    [On the other hand], they who oppose the Prophet (sws) even after the path of guidance is fully evident to them, and leaving the path of those who sincerely professed faith in you follow some other path, We will put them on the path on which they themselves went and cast them into Hell. It is a very evil abode. [Thus, this is what happened and leaving the path of faith, they have now joined the Idolaters. Tell them:] God will not forgive associating partners with Him. However, He will forgive [according to His law] lesser [sins] of whomsoever He wants. [So stay away from polytheism] and [remember] he who imputes partners to God has strayed far indeed. (4:115-116)

    • Ahmad Shoaib

      Contributor October 23, 2020 at 4:14 pm

      No mention of of any other parties is there. It simply says all sins.

    • Umer

      Moderator October 23, 2020 at 4:15 pm

      According to His law AKA Justice.

  • Umer

    Moderator October 23, 2020 at 4:12 pm

    Please also refer to the video below from 38:07 to 39:19

    • Ahmad Shoaib

      Contributor October 23, 2020 at 4:16 pm

      The argument for tawhid is the Quran and God telling us so right?

    • Umer

      Moderator October 23, 2020 at 4:32 pm

      Please see this from 4:54 to 6:48

    • Ahmad Shoaib

      Contributor October 23, 2020 at 4:37 pm

      So it’s correct- the evidence w have for fitrah is from the divine sources telling us so right?

    • Umer

      Moderator October 23, 2020 at 6:11 pm

      Tawhid is also the same kind of divine reminders of fitrat the way eating of tayyaibaat and khabaees are reminded.

    • Ahmad Shoaib

      Contributor October 23, 2020 at 6:13 pm

      Isn’t that a massive claim though? The world has been mostly polytheistic throughout history whereas things like eating lions has not. Same as where homosexuality has not been a major practise. But polytheism has been this way. So is it really comparable?

    • Umer

      Moderator October 23, 2020 at 6:14 pm

      How do you know that polytheism has always been this way?

    • Ahmad Shoaib

      Contributor October 23, 2020 at 6:18 pm

      Well so many prophets had to be sent and the Quran gives a list of prophets coming to their people saying worship Allah alone. This obviously means they were doing shirk

    • Umer

      Moderator October 23, 2020 at 6:52 pm

      2:213 tells about a period of monotheism and righteousness and we do not know how long was that period. Therefore, saying that polytheism has always been there, would be a little unfair. Secondly, there could be many nations to whom prophets were sent and they reverted back to the right path which were not mentioned. Just because nations on whom punishment was inflicted were mentioned in Quran for Inzaar purposes, doesn’t mean we should discount the possibility of other nations who listened to their prophets completely but are not mentioned in Quran.

      Besides, the only argument is favour of open polytheism is ancestral tradition without any actual logical basis for it. At the end of the day, it doesn’t matter for how long polytheism has had been in practice, the problem is that this practice has no merits whatsoever.

      Instead of looking in the past, you should engage in discussion with Non-Muslim friends of yours who are involved in such practice and ask for a logical basis for this practice.

      Discussion 33306 • Reply 33580

    • Umer

      Moderator October 23, 2020 at 4:32 pm

      Please see this from 26:03 to 28:35

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